"That's sooooo gay!"

[Dr_Evil_Mouse]

I do not think a court of law can uphold "sensitivity, maturity, and intelligence", nor should it.

I don't think anyone's asking it too in this case; it's a pity it had to get to that level of arbitration, though. imo, it should have been adequately addressed in the classroom or somewhere else at the school.

And on second thought, isn't one of the functions of the judiciary to at least reflect and uphold the degree of development a society's managed to secure for itself? Why do why bother with things like constitutions? Why do we remind kids as they grow up that there are benchmarks to respect and rely upon, so that if, e.g., a woman is denied something strictly because of her gender, she has some recourse?

[Ms Zimmy]

I knew a woman who's name was Gay Campbell...and some new neighbors moved in next door to her. The neighbors son, about 15 was outside and she walked up to him and said

"hi, I'm Gay Campbell"

and the kid looked a bit freaked out, turned and walked quickly back into his house.

She later found out the kid ran to his mom and said

"the lady next door new my name was Campbell and told me she was gay"

I love that story.

[edger]

Sometimes I have a hard time seeing the logic behind trying to rid intolerant behaviour through a no tolerance policy. This is not to say that the issue of people spewing out racial, sexist or otherwise ignorant slurs should not be addressed. However, I would think the school would likely gain more ground if they had regular classes/workshops, etc. that promoted tolerance of diversity in all of its forms. (Instead of a no tolerance, end of story, look the other way and hope it doesn't happen again approach). To me that would set a good foundation for explaining the negative and positive connotations of the words we choose to use. And if the negative behaviour continues, then atleast a student cannot pretend that they did not realize the implications of their words and actions. Under such a scenario a more severe punishment may prove to be worthwhile (i.e. release the hounds)...

A child should be able to attend a public school without fear of daily harassment. The rest of the world may be a different story, but if you have to go to school by law, than you should be able to do so with a baseline sense of security.

[Dr_Evil_Mouse]

I think you're spot on, Edger, in terms of the dodginess of no-tolerance policies; I think there's a kind of built-in anti-authoritarianism with a lot of kids when they're in school that can make that sort of thing counterproductive (i.e., to then use unwanted language just because you're not supposed to, whatever the reasons). And yet, knowing that there is something instituted does give elemental security where needed.

I'm old enough to remember people being sent down to the office for not standing during the Lord's Prayer. It's nice to know that evolution is possible.

[edger]

Yeah, I just figure that if people have been raised in such a way that limits their tolerance of others (or have just lacked some exposure to difference) than it could be argued that they may not know any better. Responding to such a scenario with more harsh intolerance is not going to pave a smooth way for someone who needs to create a new way of thinking and interacting with the rest of the world. In fact, I would argue that it may in fact make matters worse. I figure demonstrating that there is a better alternative to the way one thinks or behaves, and giving good arguments as to why it is a better alternative is probably going to be more effective.

But there will always be assholes.

[ollie]

I find it a little hard to wrap my head around this because the word gay, by true definition, has nothing to do with homosexuality, and only takes on it's reference because of cultural influence. And furthermore, the use of the word gay in this context was meant to imply "stupid, silly, dumb", which is ANOTHER definition imposed by cultural influence.

I suppose the latter just needs a little more time for the older folk 'in charge' to catch on!

Stupid word policing.

Are you ok with nigger?

[Birdy]

It's a word Ollie. It's all in how you take it. I do find it a bit friggin' ridiculous that there's an unspoken law that some people can use the word nigger, but other's can't. There aren't any alternate definitions of the word either, as there are for 'gay'.

[ollie]

There aren't any alternate definitions of the word either, as there are for 'gay'.

It has one meaning that doesn't specifically refer to black people.

Main Entry: nig·ger

Pronunciation: \ˈni-gər\

Function: noun

Etymology: alteration of earlier neger, from Middle French negre, from Spanish or Portuguese negro, from negro black, from Latin niger

Date: 1786

1usually offensive; see usage paragraph below : a black person

2usually offensive; see usage paragraph below : a member of any dark-skinned race

3: a member of a socially disadvantaged class of persons

[MasterShake]

That's so Mormon!

[bald guy in a blanket]

As a teacher, I think this a great example of an educator opting to not educate.

Yes, comparing "gay" to "stupid", "silly" and "dumb" is at least painfully ignorant if not offensive.

and...yes, the fact that this girl's excuse is the very thing that is offensive makes me want to require parents to undergo a written test to prevent mandatory abortion.

...but, this was a chance to teach students why what the student said was wrong.

A sadly missed chance too.

I'm tired of people expecting schools to be perfect environments...they're not. They are filled with ignorant people (some of whom go on to become ignorant lawyers, I'm afraid)...that's why they exist.

So say what you want...just be okay with being informed of bigotry and ignorance.

Jef

P.S.The parent sued over being sent to the office??? You just know that her teachers LOVE parent interview night.

[bald guy in a blanket]

And furthermore, the use of the word gay in this context was meant to imply "stupid, silly, dumb", which is ANOTHER definition imposed by cultural influence.

The root, or cultural influence, of this definition is highly suspect, actually.

GAY=BAD

Consider the cultural influence.

Gay means happy, right?

Homosexual people were called "gay" for apparent, albeit humourous, reasons (ie. "he's just seems...um, happier than normal guys")

How do we get to bad?

Well...The word faggot means a bundle of sticks to be burned (sobering when you consider why this has come to mean homosexual also, no?)

Faggot developed into "fag-end" which refers to the burnt end of a stick...the useless or BAD part.

So the definition could more accurately be tracked as

FAG=GAY=BAD=to be burnt

Are you still comfortable with this definition?

Jef

[Birdy]

It's not about definitions. It's about how we individually interpret them. What you interpret, someone else interprets differently. And it goes both ways, for the good, and for the bad.

edit to add: i drew differences in definitions to show how various interpretations are possible.

Also important to remember, is that cultural definitions are limited to cultures. People of other cultures, may have absolutely no idea that an 'ok' word for them, might be so negative to a person of different culture.

Edited March 2, 2007 by Guest

[MarcO]

as if punishing someone for using a naughty word is going to change any individual attitudes about homophobia, or racism, or whatever the case may be.

We give words power, we can take that power away. Language is dynamic, not static.

[Baj]

[Birdy]

YAY MARCO! YAY MARCO! YAY MARCO!

This may be a major breakthrough.. but I AGREE!

Edited March 2, 2007 by Guest

[MarcO]

thanks but I should also say that I think some words are just dumb and immature words to use.

[phishtaper]

like? (I dare ya)

[SmoothedShredder]

The Meaning of a word is its Use.

- Ludvig Wittgenstein

[Birdy]

thanks but I should also say that I think some words are just dumb and immature words to use.

And we agree again.

[MarcO]

like? (I dare ya)

words like "Umphrey's", or "McGee". Words that are offensive like that.

[Dr_Evil_Mouse]

Or "Ratdog".

[phishtaper]

lol, you guys are sooooo gay

[Jared]

All i would say on this is that I agree that that is a commonly used term, to refer to something, that is stupid, not cool, lame, or just dumb, I've probalby used it a ton of times with out thinking.

after reading this topic a few times and thinking about it, i do see how its a stupid thing to say, using the term "gay" to be a negative thing, cant be helping anyone.

that being said. i used to work at a company, that owned sevral busniess in toronto. there were alot of diffrent people working there, from many back grounds, we were all good friend, and the work place was extreamly relaxed, people would always be making raciest/ discriminatory jokes or remarks. it was just the way it was. a majority of the staff were jewish, and the owner was not. Thre were alot of typical steriotype jokes around all the time. but alot of it was towards the jewish staff.

after a few years, the trem "jewing" became popluar, for when some one would be cheep, or ask for a deal, and what not.

even though i didnt really care, and knew it was a joke, and not really moent ot be descrimanatory, it was always a bit annoying, and you could tell it made people unconfortable

this is basically the same thing. people might not thing what it really means or how other peole take it, when they say somthing like "thats gay"

i guess is we were all a bit more aware, the workd would be alot nicer

[dancingbear]

Been on this rant for a while now....nice to see the tides turning...as many on this board use the term 'gay', yet dont seem to be piping up now....this is from my post..a couple years ago...

08/30/05 11:44 PM - Post#261052

So why do people still feel the need to call things 'gay' or use words like 'faggot'? (i ask this to those of you on this board who use it in your posts) is this actually funny?

to me the political correctness movement was a good thing. i mean when someone says something that is different is 'gay' a sterotype is projected. do the grade fours and fives who say something is gay realize this? i doubt it. but it does penetrate on an unconscious level, equating gay with negativity . disrupting the psyche. propagating sterotype and unacceptance.

if a child grows up without 'this' (this being the thoughts in my head right now) even entering their mind, i feel it could have tremendous positive influence on uniting the world? hyperbole? maybe. but all big change stems from somewhere.

for the most part i do not see people writing ethnicity based wisecracks. is there a difference?

somewhere along the line did it become o.k. to stereotype some groups and not others?

If a friend makes a comment and you know their heart sparkles with love, kindness and acceptance i can see why someone would laugh. it is an intimate setting, with mutual understanding. this, the internet, is like shouting to the world, and for what it's worth i think we should be careful what we shout.

http://www.jambands.ca/sanctuary/showtopic.php?tid/224560/post/261052/hl//

[meggo]

a-fuckin'-men