Family Structure Discussion

[bradm]

This may be the most political (and least musical; I'm not even humming as I type this...) topic I've started, but I think it might interesting to have a topic dedicated to discussions and ideas about family structure, separate from the election topic (though not necessarily without discussion of the election itself).

My thoughts on family structure come from a couple of what you might consider off-beat sources. The first of them is Alvin Toffler. While "Future Shock" is his most famous work, a better (IMO) book by him is "The Third Wave". The premise of this book is that society has undergone waves of change. 10,000 years ago (or so), there was a change from hunter-gatherer nomadic society, to stay-in-one-place-and-grow-stuff agrarian society. About 500 years ago, there was another wave of change, this time from agrarian society to what's become known as industrial society; in essence, the industrial revolution was not just the invention of the steam engine; instead, it changed everything, including people's genetic diversity (because they could now ride trains to visit and mate with people from exotic locales, like the next county).

According to Toffler, we're in the midst of a third wave of change, from industrial society to what he calls "super-industrial society" (and what others call "post-industrial society", a term both Toffler and I don't like).

I saw an interview with Toffler a few years back, and he said he'd been in ongoing discussion with Newt Gingrich, and that Gingrich agreed with Toffler about this in-process wave of change on all points except one: Gingrich believed the third wave could happen but that society could keep the traditional/nuclear family structure. Toffler's point was that when a wave of change affects society, it affects all aspects of it: economics, law, technology, health, the family, everything. Another aspect of super-industrial society (according to Toffler) is a sort of "splintering" of things. While the 20th Century prominently featured big, general-purpose things (even corporations: General Motors, General Electric, General Dyamics, etc.), super-industrial society will have smaller things; witness the number of people who are now independent contractors, and the amount of outsourcing (and thus, specialization) being done. What this means is that you have a lot more things, and they're of very different kinds than before.

Could not the same apply to the family structure?

The other source is the novel, "The Moon Is A Harsh Mistress" by Robert A. Heinlein. While ostensibly a science fiction novel, it deals with a lunar penal colony gaining its independence, and setting up its own rules, which include other forms of families: contract marriages (of a specified term, with specified responsibility), line marriages (sort of like joining a corporation), etc. Each has its advantages (and disadvantages), and each works a different way.

I wonder if, as a society, we should at least examine things like this (including completely-out-of-left-field things like line marriages), with an eye to whether they'll help solve some of the other problems in society.

Of course, if Canada were to greatly expand the definition of family, making it interwork with other jurisdictions (especially the USA) will be difficult, but that's challenge, not a show-stopper.

OK, let 'er rip, people.

Aloha,

Brad

[Lazlo]

What's the question?

[bradm]

What controls should government put in place to ensure there are no families structured so as not to produce any more Lazlos?

Aloha,

Brad

Edited December 9, 2005 by Guest

[d_rawk]

First, I want to restate - we need a politics forum on jambands!

Second -- I have long thought that the idea of the atomic family unit as 'traditional' was absolute short-sighted insanity, and a view that seemed to somehow overlook the entirety of history. The atomic family is a response to industrialization, and an advocacy of circumstances suited to the particular demands of industrialization. It is new. It is both new and despite its newness, quite possibly already obsolete.

The 'traditional family' is the furthest thing from 'traditional'. This thread should be interesting.

[Lazlo]

What controls should government put in place to ensure there are no families structured so as not to produce any more Lazlos?

Aloha,

Brad

Guillotines, but really small ones.

[Birdy]

What controls should government put in place to ensure there are no families structured so as not to produce any more Lazlos?

Aloha,

Brad

absolutely none.

[d_rawk]

BardM - My mom is a professor in sociology. You might enjoy her marriage and the family class. She teaches it from a left leaning perspective. If you ever want a free textbook on the subject let me know.

I'm neither BardM nor BradM, but I really would!

Where is your mother a professor?

[Birdy]

honestly, do you guys feel as it is within the government of Canada's "right" to establish the definition of "family"?

[Dr_Evil_Mouse]

honestly, do you guys feel as it is within the government of Canada's "right" to establish the definition of "family"?

This is precisely what's going on, and what has people at one another's throats in Canada and the US. All sorts of laws and tax considerations come into play, as well as curricula for schools and the like.

[Dr_Evil_Mouse]

She gets a lot of free text books.

It is one of the perks. I got a good batch just over the summer alone, and in areas where my interests and teaching history are tangential at best. It's crazy that they charge so much for the bloody things and then fire them off at some people with nothing more to go on than a quick internet search to see who's teaching what where and might be interested enough to order a bunch for a class. Guess it must pay off sooner or later.

[Hal Johnson]

I dont think you can put a label on any family. They are what they are. Some families all love each other, others pretend to, and others could care less. Some families include all of the above. Im not sure what anyone's getting at, no offense, but it's allways gonna come down to a Daddy a Mommy and child. Labels are for the Government to make statistics with. And by the way, the traditional family is officially called a "Nuclear Family," these days.

[d_rawk]

but it's allways gonna come down to a Daddy a Mommy and child

that so?

[edit:] good call on the nuclear, though. We were starting to sound sorta creepily dated 'round here.

[jonyak]

I don;t beleive that the government has any rigth to put nay laws on what a family is. there are so many different and fully functioning kinds of families.

and on the free book topic: Free books are good books.