drugs and jam bands?

[mikey d]

what is everybody's opinion on the mixture of drugs with watching live jam bands?

When I saw Medeski Martin and Wood a couple of weeks ago I was tripping on acid plus alot of pot and It was a great music experience; possibly one of the best I have ever had while watching another band.

Whenever I watch a local jam band (there's not many) I like to have smoked a nice joint before hand to make the show more fun.

Whenever I am jamming with my own jam band I don't like to be high when rehearsing, but I love to be high while performing.

What is everybody elses opinion on watching jam bands while high, or musicians opinions on jamming/performing while high?

[meggo]

i think that drugs can enhance the experience of going to see a band, i for one usually like to get into something when i go to a show. but, i also think that you should remember why you're there, and that's mainly to appreciate good music. that means to me that drugs shouldn't be a necessity, just some added fun! : )

[PhishyK]

When I was in a jam band last year, we found that smoking pot before shows was a bit of a curse, as it tended to make the drummer separate from reality and become alot less sensitive.

I also find that I can dance alot longer and harder with no pot in my system.

But that's just me.

Meggo, are you in Victoria BC?

Kev

[meggo]

hey kev, at the moment i'm at my ontario location, for the past 4 years i've been bouncing between here and vic (i go to uvic). i will be back in victoria for school in september, we should meet up! have you checked out any of the victoria bands, green room and GNU are really good if you haven't seen them yet. cheers!

[Thumpin]

Gnu no longer exists and Greenroom are Vancouverites (but get over here quite a bit). The west coast is kind of hurting for good solid jambands at the moment but I'm sure it is a cyclical thing, never the less any of you Ontarian and East Coastian bands that feel like making the trip, get your ass out here.

Re: Drugs and music. I like drugs that enhance the senses while listening to music. I don't like drinking and seeing good music because although I have a good time, it is alot less due to the fact that I'm hearing good music than it is I am drunk.

[PhishyK]

Sorry meggo, I'm moving to Toronto at the end of August! Maybe i'll pass you somewhere on the Trans-Canada.

Any of you Victorians ever see Chameleon last year?

As for Victoria jam bands... the latest popular thing is the Wassabi Collective but personally I am not too excited about them. I've seen 4 shows, one was really good, the other three were fairly wanky. Anyways...

[Maddak]

I may not fully be able to post in this thread, but I'm going to try anyways

First off, I don't do drugs, any. Never have, and don't really plan on it. It's just my own personal choice for my own personal me. I haven't got a problem with them, or people doing them around me, as anyone who met/remembers me from CTMF can possibly attest to. And therefore I can't comment on how pot smoking would enhance your musical enjoyment, but I can say that anything that distracts you from enjoying the music, if that's your reason for being there, probably isn't productive in my own opinion. Just from my own observations of others I'd have to agree with AC/DC in that most drunk people aren't really enjoying the show as much as the probably could or should be, and sometimes they even tend to forget that they've even seen the bands play *cough*canned beats *cough*

sorry dude, had to include it!

So basically, to sum it up, I'd say to each their own, but I'd think that if you're so blasted out of your tree that it's the high you're enjoying and not the show, what's the point of being at the show? Couldn't you have just as much fun with the high anywhere else?

[meggo]

AC DC - what happened to GNU??? i caught them in the spring before coming back to ontario.... that sucks. they are awesome. i've seen wasabi collective a few times as well and i agree with you. they're alright, but you know. i like the other drummer guy who used to play outside of steamers.

[Thumpin]

Hey Meggo, you probably saw the last show. Bassist is off to study Jazz at U of T, and sometimes people just grow apart I guess. I have to agree about Wassabi, a long drum jam, It can fun, and the band and the people at the shows are really nice relaxed people but it's not taking me anywhere...yet hopefully, alot of practice and writing could turn that around in a second. Still waiting for a well rehearsed jamband to resurface from the pool of musicians here. It'll happen.

[secondtube]

i'd need more than acid to make it through a whole MMW performance!

[weezy]

oh, 2T - have you made that doctors appointment yet? (I'm just fugginwitya...)

I like drugs AND I like music. Smokin pot is GREAT for listening to music - it has been proven by scientists that pot enhances your musical enjoyment. (I like science too) However, it doesn't enhance you ability to play music, therefore, I usually refrain from tokin' before a show.

Acid and E are great for (attending) the big shows and almost always make a great night even more memorable. I fully endorse the use of pot, acid, e, shrooms and the odd night of table skiing - but nothing too far beyond that.

Anyone heard of 2CT7? I smoked it once and DAMN it was fun...

Here's one of my fav websites - everything you wanted to know about drugs and more...

the drug vaults of erowid

YAY DRUGS!!

[scarlet]

a repply to maddak's last question:

to me, no, i cant have as much fun anywhere else on some drug - or maybe i do, but it is a totally different experiece.

tripping with a live band is conceivably different (for me at least) than eating mushrooms at some kids house. its some sort of interaction or something, i dont know...

rolling at a live music thing is different too, plus, the high is much more fun during the excitement and energy of the actual concert than, i dont know, on the radio or something.

smoking pot is a personal thing for me at least. this sounds so weird, but there are some bands i just cant handle hearing stoned. but others i do.

so i guess its not to say that someone cant have fun with any high somewhere else, cause you can, but it would not be the same experience as at a live show.

[Maddak]

I stand corrected, like I said I've got no personal experience so I'm basically talking out of my ass on this one.

Everyone's got their own way of having a good time, and I usually prefer to refrain from commenting on other people's. Guess I should remember that more often.

[teetervillestation]

drugs seem to be a pretty big part of the jamband scene - i would guess that at the last CTF that maybe 80% of us were wasted from something or another at one point. from a players point of view, my experience is that drugs can only enhance something thats already good to begin with. there has got to be good energy already present - if there isnt, then a drug will only bring the energy level down. when drugs create problems for musicians (for anybody!) is when folks take them to get into a good place, the good place has to be there first! if it is, and if things are taken in moderation - then a few extra doors can be opened, especially in the improvisational jamband context. now i'm a piano player so i'm maybe a little more free to 'mentally experiment' then would be a drummer who has the primary and more physical job of maintaining good solid time.

[dancingfool]

Well, personally, the only drug I ever ingest is alcohol, and in severe moderation. But I don't necessarily frown on those who take other drugs, as long as they're responsible about it. I haven't seen a problem at any of the nugget shows I attended, for example; yet I get annoyed at the adults who imbibe a lot and talk loudly outside my window until 3 am.

I can definitely see how some mind-altering substance can enhance one's enjoyment of a concert; and if you don't intend to dance, then heavy stuff seems quite doable. For me, as I dance, I must maintain both complete control of my body to dance and not careen into other people (doing the responsible thing), and still be able to access the band's energy.

I seem to be strange in that I don't need anything to do this acces to the level I attain. The few times I did try alcohol before dancing have met with failure (beer is a complete no-no as it fizzes fiercely in the stomach; the D&T/GTB gig had me going all-out with a shot in me, and getting sick due to it), so I just eat enough to get energy to keep going, and then plug myself on the band for the evening.

Different drugs react differently in different bodies. If it works, no problem. That's my take.

[as is]

i'd have to agree with maddak on this one. i do take drug, but would rather not be tripping out during a show. people say that it enhances your musical experience, but how can that be if you're not fully aware of what is going on? when i see a good band, the energy in the room is enough of a high for me.

not that i have a problem with drugs, or people using them at shows, i just think you can absorb more of the experience if it's just you listening, not the drugs.

[scarlet]

“A drug is not bad. A drug is a chemical compound. The problem comes in when people who take drugs treat them like a license to behave like an asshole.”

— Frank Zappa

a drug doesnt neccesarily "enhance your musical experience". a drug makes it a different experience, and sometimes, for some people, that experince is better or more fun. but i do know what you mean about just feeding off the energy a good band is putting out!

[show---whore]

Maddak

im not into doing drugs at shows anyomore i found that getting really fucked up at show would sometime kill the show for me. i go to all most all show with a clean head and i really get to take the music in. no bad trips no im to brunt out to dance. i stay away from drungs and even beers there a show killer for me to.

[PhishyK]

hey Meggo --- that "other drummer guy" you speak of is the famous Stephen Moore. Last year he was the guitarist and singer in my old band and he made the cover of Monday Mag! An all around good guy.

We started playing music together way way back in 1997 - jeez how time flies.

[weezy]

read this article

quote:

---

...I can say that anything that distracts you from enjoying the music, if that's your reason for being there, probably isn't productive in my own opinion.

---

If you've never tried a drug - how can you have any opinion on the subject? (there, that's better..) People have been doing drugs since the beginning of time for a myriad reasons from spiritual to recreational - it's only since the conception of the American right-wing movement that drugs have been frowned upon. (very ironic considering the legal drug industry in the USA) I personally don't trust anyone who hasn't at least tried pot or shrooms/acid or something...

I do agree that drinking excessively and music enjoyment do not mix and that being waaaaaaay fucked out of your tree on some drug won't help either. The effect of all drugs is best achieved through moderation - it's the morons that drop 10 hits at once who give drugs a bad name.

As far a jamband fans go - drugs are a perfect companion. Read the 'what makes a jamband' thread and it's clear that improvisation and unpredictability are the real hooks of the music. Since drugs alter and expand your perception, they are ideal for enhancing this type of music.

When your high enough, the music becomes the drug - I think that's what most of us are after when we use drugs at shows.

there's my $0.04

[as is]

"If you've never tried a drug - you DO NOT have any worthwhile opinion on the subject."

don't you think that might be going a bit to far? even if maddak's never taken drugs, being around people who are high, and a lot the time, most people at jamband shows are high on something, you are provided with a certain insight into the behaviour of high people, what drugs can do to you, and the experiences you can have when you're high. besides, everyone is entitled to an opinion.

"When your high enough, the music becomes the drug - I think that's what most of us are after when we use drugs at shows."

why not try a little experiment, go to a show sober (or relitivly sober) and just let the music BE the drug, because if you're high, then the drugs are the drugs, and the music is just secondary. and since it's supposed to be about the music, why not try just listening to it without all of the other distractions?

(i'm really not arguing against drugs, just suggesting another option)

(i'm not arguing against drugs, or drugs at jamband shows, you can do wahtever you want, just an opinion)

[Phred]

quote:

---

Origionally posted by: Scarlet

“A drug is not bad. A drug is a chemical compound. The problem comes in when people who take drugs treat them like a license to behave like an asshole.”

— Frank Zappa

---

Agreed. This has always been one of my favourite Zappa quotes.

quote:

---

originally posted by: Weezy

If you've never tried a drug - you DO NOT have any worthwhile opinion on the subject.

---

Hhmmm.... I am not sure I agree with that.

I think that everyone's opinion is worthwhile. Potentially an argument can lack relevant information to be valuable or credible, but not an opinion. An opinion is just that; an opinion. It can't really be worthless, because it is not meant to support anything.

My opinion (from someone whose drug of choice is alcohol) is that I understand that drugs change the way that music, as well as other things, is perceived, most of the time, moderate injestion does nice things to my emotions which in turn help the music sound better to me.

Mostly I like to play music sober, because I find that any type of alteration can effect the way that I play. Ocasionally I will injest a couple of beers before a show, but I find that any more than that will effect, not my enjoyment of the music that I am playing, but my ability to play the music. In other words, I will think that I am playing well, but I won't be.

my 0.03 lira

Phred

[dancingfool]

Two small things - I think the right-wing/puritan sentiment was continued from the British settlers' time, not born in the USA per se, though it has its strongest proponents there now; and I believe it's possible for one to have at least some (small) idea of an experience through vicarious means. In other words, learn from other people's experiences and/or mistakes.

I guess I'm just lucky I don't need drugs to achieve the altered state of consciousness I get when dancing like I do to Nero, D&T, EtH. But there's no denying I do achieve such a state. It's not the same as those taking a hit, but it's one nonetheless. Ask Ms Hux, bradm, arcane, or others who've seen me dance.

[weezy]

1) "When your high enough, the music becomes the drug - I think that's what most of us are after when we use drugs at shows."

To me, music is a drug already. But as a music PHREAK, I want to try and take this drug (music) to another level - a type of nirvana. Recreational drugs can help to attain that. That's what I meant by the above statement. (high enough = not too high - but just right)

Of course I've been to many shows sober as a judge and had a great, predictable time. Watching live music sober is fantastic - you remember it afterwards and hear it in perfect 3 dimensional sound. But drugs can add another 50 dimensions...

When the right mix of chemical and music is reached, there is nothing distracting about it - it's pure perfection.

2) "If you've never tried a drug - you DO NOT have any worthwhile opinion on the subject."

I stand by that statement. What if someone who's never even heard a Phish song posted their opinion of Phish music in this forum...

maddak - u already qualified your first response, so sorry for jabbin' at ya... I just felt like throwing an onion in the ointment. C'mon, have a toke... all the cool kids are doin' it...

p.s. - DF - you should watch a documentary called 'weed' narrated by Woody Harrelson - it explains the history of the drug war in the States - very interesting.

[Maddak]

Alright, apparently I've offended some or hit a sensitive nerve or something.

Like I said, I choose for ME not to do drugs for my own personal reasons which I won't even bother getting into here. I have nothing against other people choosing to do them, and I totally agree that it's an ass backwards move for most of these drugs to be illegal while alcohol is so "morally correct" simply because it's tax-able to the governmet (I'm not saying anything against booze either). I am totally a free willed person. Do what you want for you, it's up to YOU.

I just happen to be like dancingfool on this one. I don't feel that I need the drugs or the alcohol to get to some altered state of enjoyment, of the music, the moment or anything else.

Weezy,

I'd like to think I'm allowed to have an OPINION about whatever I want to have one about. It's my own thoughts, and I can have those about whatever I please. But, like I said in an earlier post, I can be WRONG. Some of that is due to lack of experience but trust me, I've been around enough high, stoned, drunk and ass backwards people, and heard enough stories about bad trips, to be able to gleam some understanding as to how it can affect you. What I said was "distracts you from enjoying the music, if that's your reason for being there" should be read as: If you are so far gone that you're not really aware of the music in the room (remember I'm only speculating that this can actually happen because, no, it hasn't ever happened to me personally) then the experience has ceased to be about the music and is now about the high. Now if the music was your intention and reason for being there (also in the above statement) then you have negated your own reason for being at the show. Still, I never said anything about it being wrong or right, it's a personal choice. And I definately didn't say anything as to the high being wrong. My statement was all about the music. As to not being trust worthy because of my personal choice, I find that one a little bit confusing, I personally see myself as an extremely trusthworthy person. If you don't know me and are simply forming an opinion on me because I don't smoke pot that seems a little quick to judge. That's like any right wing politian saying that all pot smokers are burn outs that won't ever accomplish anything. We both know that's not true. But I do find it noteworth that you've told me that my opinion is not worthwhile, then go on to agree with me..why?