Bar sheik, religious groups tell Ottawa

[StoneMtn]

This is one of those issues on which I don't know where to take a stand. Of course, I am inclined to protect freedom of expression as a Canadian value. That said, I also don't like the idea of some guy coming to our country to preach to our citizens against and inciting hate and violence against me, and others. I'm interested in others' thoughts on the following...

Bar sheik, religious groups tell Ottawa

Allison Hanes

National Post

Saturday, June 24, 2006

Leaders of the Jewish, Muslim, Hindu and gay communities have formed an unlikely alliance to demand that the federal government bar from Canada a controversial cleric from the United Kingdom who they say actively preaches intolerance and hatred.

Sheik Riyadh ul-Haq is scheduled to speak next week at a youth conference hosted by the Islamic Foundation of Toronto.

Organizers of a symposium this weekend at Universite de Montreal, where Mr. ul-Haq was scheduled to speak, cancelled his appearance this week "in order to ensure safety on the campus of our university and to avoid any tension within our society."

Focus has now shifted to Toronto, where the Youth Tarbiyah Conference is to open on June 30.

In a letter addressed to Monte Solberg, the Minister of Citizenship and Immigration, the Canadian Jewish Congress, the Muslim-Canadian Congress, the Hindu Dharma Mission and Egale Canada asked him to consider denying Mr. ul-Haq entry into the country on the basis of his past inflammatory rhetoric.

The four groups, echoed by B'nai Brith Canada, contend that in past speeches, widely available over the Internet, Mr. ul-Haq has promoted anti-Semitic stereotypes, scorned fellow Muslims who associate with homosexuals and stoked historical cleavages between the Islamic and Hindu faiths...

...

Full story here.

[Dr_Evil_Mouse]

It's not clear either whether banning this character will give the goofs who follow him a further sense of being disenfranchised, and thus "fighting the good fight". More might be done behind these doors than outside of them. I'm hoping sensible people from the Muslim community will show up to monkey-wrench this bullshit.

[StoneMtn]

Aaah. Yes.

Thus the argument in favour of letting people speak. Presumably it allows for dialogue and more intelligent views to come out in argument against it, etc. It's the whole ratonale for hating what someone says, but still doing everything to protect their right to say it.

I tend to be generally of that view, but it's also pretty easy to fall into the mindset that if someone wants to come to my country to bad-mouth me, maybe I should just not let him in. (It certainly shows me how that sort of human tendency can easily be manipulated to serve a particular group's own ends, by fear-mongers, etc.)

[Jaimoe]

The KKK are banned in Canada for practising simimilar hatred.

[StoneMtn]

On what grounds were they banned, though? I'm guessing that they have already disseminated hate in this country, and were then banned.

I think that in this case, we are talking about banning him because we expect him to disseminate hate.

Again, I'm inclined to keep the scumbag out of our country, but the civil libertarian in me has a problem with that.

[Alexis]

i have a HUGE problem with what we expect the guy to say. but i don't think that gives me the right to tell him not to say it.

as for the disenfranchised arguement....i would say that's entirely possible, and fuck i hate having to be politically correct all the time, being politically correct makes ME feel disenfranchised. now do i have an excuse to do and say whatever i want despite the repercussions?

people in the muslim community wanted sharia law in this province...in this country. here's a perfectly good oppurtunity to police themselves. don't show support for this man speaking to their community.

[Dr_Evil_Mouse]

I realised right after I'd posted how much I hate it whenever I hear "the *** community" of any kind, because it has the effect of suggesting that there's some sort of consensus that holds them together, when in fact there typically isn't. I knew more Muslims in TO who argued against the sharia system than who were behind it. I suppose what I meant to say was that I hoped that people who defined themselves as Muslim show up and make countervailing arguments, framed in Islamic terms, against what this guy has to say. I know that kind of hope is so much pissing in the wind, given how mute liberal Christians tend to be in the face of evangelicals et al. in this country. "Too polite", I'm inclined to guess, even when people get on 100 Huntley St. routinely arguing that Canada is a Christian country and all other faiths should convert to their narrow band of evangelicalism or quietly disappear.

Of course, given Canadian politeness, civility, and, I hope, aversion to violence, they're not going to agitate for the elimination of entire groups of people, like you see among radical Wahhabis, or, conversely, among Hindutva radicals arguing for the extermination of all Muslims in India.

[StoneMtn]

So, Evil:

Do you happen to have any liberal, intelligent, gutsy, Muslim students? You can prep a few of them (with your own unassailable brand of intelligent arguments) and send them in to the Youth Tarbiyah Conference to speak out against this crap. I'd love to see that!

It's only a few hours' drive between Ottawa and Toronto...

[thatpatguy]

The Current on CBC had a thing on him today..

you can listen to it here (if you have realplayer): http://www.cbc.ca/thecurrent/2006/200606/20060626.html

[Dr_Evil_Mouse]

unassailable brand of intelligent arguments

Oh, you mean, "people should be nice to one another," that sort of thing ? I am sorry if I'm coming across callow, though.

This is the problem - there has to be a lebenswelt-sturdy recognition of knowing what buttons are being pushed when, and then knowing, and having the resources to access, what works best against it. In other words, it beats the fuck out of me; I'm just hoping somebody out there has the insight. As Adorno used to say, the professional agitator is a masterly salesman of his own psychological defects, a master practitioner of "psychoanalysis in reverse"; what are needed are compassionate theologians. Problem is, some of the most insightful Muslims I've met have been feminists, who don't hold much currency with these peckerheads.

[StoneMtn]

Surely, there are some male feminists among this group, who could bite their tongue for the duration of one day on that particular issue for the purpose of this particular talk?

(I say this as I am under the presumption that it is not so much the feminist ideology espoused by these people that detracts from the respect that would otherwise be given to them by the Muslim community, as their gender.)