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Hey Kev, you work for the CBC, right?

phishtaper

By phishtaper
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phishtaper Rookie

phishtaper

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so, can you tell me why Frank de Jong of the Green Party isn't invited to the Ontario Leaders debate tomorrow night?

sure, the Green Party has no seats now, but they did receive a decent vote tally in both the last federal and provincial elections (enough to win at least 1 List Member seat under MMP). the Green Party actually has some long-term momentum and it is shut out of this mainstream event. pretty sad, I think.

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Kanada Kev Newbie

Kanada Kev

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LOL ... yes, I do. This is nothing that I can control (or am involved with) sadly :(

This wouldn't be a CBC-controlled decision I don't think. The debate is being aired on many stations/streams and is probably controlled more by Elections Ontario. Maybe they have an answer (or somebody you could ask the question) on their site:

http://www.elections.on.ca/en-CA/

The program will be broadcast in high definition and shown on at least seven major broadcast outlets in Ontario: CBC-TV, CTV Television, Global Television, Citytv, CP24, TVO and CPAC. It will also be streamed live by most of the broadcast outlets on their websites.
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phishtaper Rookie

phishtaper

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participants in federal election debates are determined by a group representing the media covering the event, if my memory serves correctly.

i think so too, I didnt think elections ontario was running this. so, if the media decide who is to be part of the debate, then why is de Jong not included? true, the Greens do not currently have a seat (and that's the official cop-out excuse), but most of these media outlets have either explictly included the Green Party among their profiles of the top four parties, or de Jong and the Greens get sufficient coverage so as to imply these media outlets believe they are an important factor in the election (for many reasons, including: green issues, impact on the party of the referendum, ever increasing voter support of the party, etc.).

im not suggesting a covert agenda or anything conspiratorial, im just saying that de Jong and the Greens are sufficiently important in the political landscape of Ontario now (and will become increasingly so) that they should be represented in this event.

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Kanada Kev Newbie

Kanada Kev

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Hey Kev, can you make sure CBC shows all Sens games in HD this year? Thanks.

Bwahahaha! After the ratings for the Cup Final last year, I doubt they want to show their games much at all (unless they are playing Montreal, Toronto or Pittsburgh) ;)

I WILL be scheduling all the commercials you see during the games on CBOT though :D I'm still waiting for them to invite me there for a visit and take me to a game in thanks for all my great work, but they're cheap bastards!

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im just saying that de Jong and the Greens are sufficiently important in the political landscape of Ontario now (and will become increasingly so) that they should be represented in this event.

if they are so important, why don't they have a seat in the House?

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d_rawk Newbie

d_rawk

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We've been around this bend a few times - national level specific, I think - I wish I could pull it up, but I'm coming up bubkus with the search.

A shame, 'cause I imagine that there was a decent back and forth. Essentially it boils down to there being a lot of parties (and potential for there to be many more parties). Grits, Tories, Dippers, Greens, Libertarians, Communists, Freedom Folk, Family Coalition Types, Independents, etc.. So where do you set the cutoff? If you ask any individual party, they will surely insist that the cutoff should be exactly (their percantage of popular support - 0.001%).

What is a media consortium to do? As they do nationally, rather than trying to nail an arbitrary moving target, they set the cutoff at 1 seat. The greens got 2.8% the last round, and not enough in a single riding to secure a seat. There is, of course, a way to increase the chances that support for Green candidate translates into representation at Queen's Park .. but I've already done my share of shilling in a parallel thread.

Don't get me wrong .. for all of my reservations about Harris when he was national GP leader (and I had many), I still would have been happy to see him in the national level debate the last time around. But where do you put the target and how do you make it fair? And at not too shy of the psychological 5% mark in returns (and polling higher than that, I think, in the lead-up IIRC) you would think that would command some attention .. (308 seats * 0.045 electoral support = 13.86 seats. Except that .. it actually equals absolutely zilch).

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phishtaper Rookie

phishtaper

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Dear X (phishtaper),

I appreciate the fact that you wrote.

First I should say that the decision to do the debate with only three leaders was a decision of the seven networks involved in the debate, not just CBC.

And the decision is not based only on the fact that the Greens don't have a seat. I know there is a widespread assumption that all a party needs is one seat, and it's in. But that's not so. (What if that seat were held by a member elected for another party, but then crossed the floor? Would that count?)

There is no rigid set of critieria for inclusion in the debate.

Generally, we look at four major questions:

Not in any particular order they are:

1 - Does the party have seats in the legislature?

2 - Where is the party in recent polls?

3 - How many candidates is the party running, and how many of those candidates are considered at all likely to win a seat?

4 - How much of a presence does the party have between elections?

We have set no specific level the party has to reach on any of these criteria, but we look at the entire picture and then use our best judgment to decide if a party should be sharing the precious debate time.

The issue of how many candidates for example, taken in a federal context, would eliminate the BQ if we simply said, 75 candidates in more than 300 ridings... not much. We don't do that. We look at what impact they will likely have on election night.

Sometimes a party can run candidates in every riding, but we evaluate their chances of winning any, some, many... and what that would do to the overall results.

Polling is another judgment. Some parties poll at a certain level just before or during a campaign, but history tells us they don't reach that level on election night.

To be clear, I'm not saying the Greens failed or passed on any of these questions - we have not set a standard for passing or failing.

I'm saying that looking at the entire picture, informed by these four major criteria, the editorial judgment of the TV networks, was that the people of Ontario would be better served hearing from three leaders in this debate.

The fact that cbc.ca includes the Green Party in its profiles is evidence that our news organization (and to be fair, the others) has not said that the Greens should be ignored. The party will be covered in our newscasts and current affairs programs and on our web sites. But the broadcast debate is limited to the three leaders for whom the vast majority of people will vote.

CBC Executive

I have removed personal information, but this is what I heard back from a CBC Executive yesterday after I wrote to ask why de Jong is not included. His phrasing is casual, given the context of my email to him, and I dont think this is a form letter, but parts of it may be standard response. I do know that the networks have received a great deal of feedback on this issue, wondering why the Green Party is not represented.

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Kanada Kev Newbie

Kanada Kev

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I have removed personal information, but this is what I heard back from a CBC Executive yesterday after I wrote to ask why de Jong is not included.

Pretty good response to your question. It's nice that they don't ignore these things. So, who was it? You can PM me if you want and I can arrange for you to be able to call him if you like ;)

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Kanada Kev Newbie

Kanada Kev

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Hey Kev, can you bring back North of 60?
bollox to that- how about Made in Canada (I love Leah Pinsent)

Sorry, not in my powers :(

Aren't you happy with the fact that Martha Stewart is on CBC every weekday now? Come on ... complain, complain, complain ... that's all ya do! :D:D

Now, how the hell do I stay awake here today after that Rush show last night?

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d_rawk Newbie

d_rawk

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bollox to that- how about Made in Canada

Hecks yeah! And The Newsroom. I think they did bring that one back for a bit in partnership with Showcase. Is it still going, I wonder?

And re-runs of This Hour Has 7 Days. For the love of God, mine your back-catalog and give us re-runs of This Hour has 7 Days (and slow down on the re-runs of This Hour .. 22 minutes while you're taking requests. Thanks.)

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bradm Newbie

bradm

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bollox to that- how about Made in Canada

Hecks yeah! And The Newsroom. I think they did bring that one back for a bit in partnership with Showcase. Is it still going' date=' I wonder?

And re-runs of This Hour Has 7 Days. For the love of God, mine your back-catalog and give us re-runs of This Hour has 7 Days (and slow down on the re-runs of This Hour .. 22 minutes while you're taking requests. Thanks.)

[/quote']

I wish the short-lived "Snakes & Ladders" series had gone on longer (I don't whether it wasn't renewed, or was supposed to be just several episodes all along).

Aloha,

Brad

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