Legal Advice (re: retail discrimination)

[zero]

Hey sorry I know StoneMtn.'s prob'ly the only one with a good sense of the legal issues here but basically this just really upset me.

I often like daily go to Mitzi's on College which is at the foot of my street and order coffee or food and use their wifi - like countless environments around the city. There's a starbucks nearby or much much better The Common where I am now. In any case I've been totally broke and because of going through some really hard ass shit with the chef I worked for I guess I was pissing off the staff. I also burn them CD's all the time and hook them up with good tips and treats (I also worked in the exact same space when it was a Thai restaurant for a year, and probably drop $50-$100 there since they opened).

In any case in an absent minded moment and this was not unrelated to be in a bit of a mental health crisis I was on top of but struggling to manage- one day I ended up having to pay with a combo of quarters, nickels and alot of pennies (for like a $1.50 coffee). I also said to the girl working at the time 'you're catching me on a really bad day, I work for a really demanding chef and it's just embarassing'.

In any case this regular server a kid who went to my high school this morning just ignored me for twenty minutes then rudely told me 'I'm not going to serve you, you paid with pennies last week, that's not cool' I then left politely and asked when I could have a discussion with management about this and he rudely said something like management would back me up on this.

In any case I know alot about tenancy law with regard to mental health shit, and human rights shit and whatnot. I guess I wonder what would an act like this be a contravention of. The product was after all paid for in whatever currency.

[AD]

Legally they don't have to accept more that 25 pennies in one transaction. I think (but am not sure) businesses can make their own policies on this too. Doubt the server knew that, but that's the law there. Dumb to refuse business though.

[Kanada Kev]

I don't know about the 25 penny rule, but it does suck that they can refuse cash! Think of the many places that won't accept $50 or $100 bills.

I remember going for a lunch with some fellow workers over to Gretzky's a few years back. When we got all the cash together to pay for the large tab, we had a couple of $50s in there. They weren't going to accept them "due to the counterfeit bills out there". I told them they were going to take them or they were going to lose out on that money. Told them to talk to Wayne and get him to supply them with some relatively cheap counterfeit detecting equipment

Next time you go there, get yer coffee and pay in their desired fashion. Then, leave them a tip of a couple of hundred pennies

[bradm]

I think there are two things here: first, the money, including the pennies, was accepted by the coffee shop (last week); that transaction is over.

The situation now is that zero is being refused service not because he wants to (again) pay with pennies, but because he's perceived by the shop as having behaved badly in the past (when he paid with pennies), and I don't think that violates any equality laws. (There are reasons, such as gender and ethnicity, which can't be used to refuse service, but I don't think past behaviour is one of them.)

Aloha,

Brad

[Northern Wish]

Piss on their walls and then call the health inspector about dirty washrooms.

But seriously the whole thing sounds weak- did you shit on their couch?

[rubberdinghy]

A couple of hundred pennies is two bucks...much more than required for a coffee tip.

Easiest solution...forget about it, go elsewhere, and spread word of mouth about your terrible experience.

Also...not sure what the bad day with your ex-boss has to do with the above mentioned story.

[AD]

Brad, how do you know the coffee joint's reasoning for doing anything?

Just go to another coffee place. Why support a place that treats you badly?

[bradm]

Brad, how do you know the coffee joint's reasoning for doing anything?

In any case this regular server a kid who went to my high school this morning just ignored me for twenty minutes then rudely told me 'I'm not going to serve you, you paid with pennies last week, that's not cool'

Aloha,

Brad

[Northern Wish]

BTW are you angling for a lawsuit here?

[Schwa.]

Roll the pennies and I'll bet they'll take them.

[phishtaper]

if you owe someone $10, you can pay them all in pennies because you already have a contract.

if you walk into a store, you are making an offer on a good to purchase. no contract yet exists and they can refuse to sell you that good.

it is legal for them to not enter into a contract with you for all sorts of reasons. and if they think or know you will be paying with more than 25 pennies, they can legally refuse to sell you coffee (ie., enter into a contract).

i learned this in grade 10 law. of course, i was stoned thru high school, so ...

[Davey Boy 2.0]

... stay in school, kids

[NewRider]

[Hux]

zero, just take 'em down like you did the Liberal Party after I crossed you a few years back.

Fuck, you ruined my life. :content:

[AD]

Bradm, I was more talking to your use of the word 'perceived', but point taken, yes.

[Davey Boy 2.0]

:chug:

[zero]

It seems like BradM and Phishtaper have sage points and you all get it. Understand that I've supported this place since it first opened, I also worked in the Thai restaurant that occupied the space for the two years before so alot of the clientele are my former clientele and also my neighbours. The servers are generally my friends.

My issue was with how this single server could unilaterally and in an aggressive fashion make this decision. Worst case scenario, the owner or manager takes you aside in Private and has a chat with you. You're not getting my drift here either, I have an invisible disability I sometimes am compelled to overtalk (hypomania) or be bad with financial management (hence the on a personal level saying the chef was putting me through hell). We're also all in the SERVICE industry.

It just goes past a "I'm not going to eat there anymore trip" for me. Also come on let's be serious here guys I'm a thug, I'm the most peaceful guy in the world but this guy went to my high school like six years before me and is a tiny little wannabe hipster douchebag who plays rugby. Two guys get into a confrontation and one is unable to act on their aggression - shit happens. Think about two male dogs meeting on a roadside- they figure out pretty quick who the alpha is.

It genuinely threw me, was really insulting and embarassing and yeah I wanted to smash the guy. Best solution seriously boys is me and my fellow sous-chef Ray Ray (who is Green Mile big, very black, hair in corn rows and the heart of an angel). We're just going to go in and have a polite breakfast - on me of course - and tip heavily next time Ryan's working.

[Hartamophone]

Also come on let's be serious here guys I'm a thug, I'm the most peaceful guy in the world but this guy went to my high school like six years before me and is a tiny little wannabe hipster douchebag who plays rugby. Two guys get into a confrontation and one is unable to act on their aggression - shit happens. Think about two male dogs meeting on a roadside- they figure out pretty quick who the alpha is.

So, just to recap: you're a thug, you're peaceful, but you'll go all Michael Vick's pitbull on this guy if you meet him on the side of the road?

Something shitty happened to you man, that's for sure, but by dragging it out, seeking legal advice and getting continually riled up, you are just giving your little friend continued power over you. Be the bigger man and forget about it - there are bigger problems in the world than some guy you used to know in high school power tripping over you in a coffee shop.

[Hartamophone]

And also I doubt very much that any human rights tribunal or relevant court would find that you had to pay with pennies because of your disability and were therefore discriminated against on those grounds.

[zero]

Guys I'm not retarded. I'm not literally going to scare the shit out of him by introducing him to Ray Ray. The guy seriously exhibited some shitty humanity and I've been really kind to him like given him hours of music and Hold Steady shit he loves and we've basically been buddies. Yes, should I let this guy rent space in my brain? No. Does this need to be discussed in private rationally with an owner yes very very much. Come on you guys get that, you can't in any occupation come at someone with aggression and embarass them in front of customers. I handled and am handling this well. I'm chilling don't sweat it, it just pissed me off to all hell.

[phishtaper]

Oh come on, Luke, everyone that comes here is a bit retarded. Look at these poor Sens fans. But yeah, I hear ya, I'd be miffed and disappointed if this whole thing happened to me as well. But what can ya do ... just evict him from your brain and find another place for a while. One that will accept pennies.

[Davey Boy 2.0]

if you wait a few weeks then go back i'm sure it'd be water under the bridge

maybe in disguise

[Northern Wish]

I'd be a bit pissed too, but I was waiting to find out if you were angling for a lawsuit to comment.

Now that it is clear you are not I have a suggestion.

I am willing to bet you aren't the first person he insulted with his attitude and that the best thing you can do is take all of the editorializing out of the situation and speak with the owner. Tell him the guy didn't want your money because it was small change, and that you felt he was rude and agressive about it. Hopefully this won't be the first complaint and the guy will be relieved of angering future customers.

It sucks to complain- but if you don't the owner never knows there is a problem. If he is already aware then you are telling him its time to act on that problem.

[Kanada Kev]

Be the bigger man and forget about it - there are bigger problems in the world than some guy you used to know in high school power tripping over you in a coffee shop.

Let it go. You are wasting valuable energy and time that could be used way more productively.

If you insist on going back there while this guy is still serving coffee/food, do you REALLY want it from him? You may feel victorious, but you'll still have spit in your coffee/food

You'd be better to tell your friend the owner/manager that you are simply disappointed with that employee and sadly will not be coming back there as long as he is employed there.

Move on.

Edited May 26, 2010 by Guest

[zero]

It's my neighborhood patio, it serves good brunch, the rest of the staff are my buds - that's it. I'm going to have an interesting chat with the owner.