H1N1 - To Vaccinate or Not to Vaccinate

[SaggyBalls]

Even the smurfs were pleasant to Gargamel, localcrew.

My heart goes out.

[Big Wooly Mammoth]

on a population level, the risks associated with getting the shot are much lower than the risks of not getting the shot.

[phishtaper]

that is true, BWM. but it certainly provides little comfort to the individual who may actually be adversely affected.

as described, the situation appears to suggest Guillain-Barré Syndrome - a sudden development of paralysis, thought to be associated with an already weakened immune system and triggered by a respiratory viral infection or certain gastro bacteria. it is quite rare in Canada with about 600 cases per year, is generally temporary, and rarely results in death.

over the past decade, less than 100 total cases have been associated with having just received a flu shot. it is indeed troubling that there appears to be linkage between receiving the shot and developing GBS. controlling for immunization versus non-immunized, actual flu sickness, however, health canada has concluded that you are much more likely to develop GBS from having the flu than from getting the flu shot. so, yes, BWM, you are absolutely correct.

[Big Wooly Mammoth]

I didn't mean to downplay the fact that there is an actual individual affected here. using population stats offers no consolation to those on the wrong end of them.

Edited December 17, 2009 by Guest

[SaggyBalls]

...and I didn't mean to downplay the reality of the situation by making reference to the smurfs.

No shot no GBS.

[AD]

health canada has concluded that you are much more likely to develop GBS from having the flu than from getting the flu shot

No shot no GBS.

So, who's right?

[phishtaper]

hmmm

[Esau.]

No shot no GBS.

Vaccinations are not the cause of the syndrome, just a possible trigger. Having surgery or getting sick (flu, cold etc) have also been linked as possible triggers. GBS can affect anybody. Saying "no shot no GBS" is nothing more then ignorance.

[nibbler]

Something about his aura of un-healthiness makes me weary of taking health and medical advice from this cat:

I wholeheartedly agree that ignorance is blissful, so long as theres a good shepherd watching over the flock

Gets complicated once the shepherd's income has been connected to the wolves bank accounts.

[Esau.]

So you believe that the scientists who have done endless studies on this stuff would outright lie about vaccinations not being the cause of GBS, but yet you have no doubt the climate scientists that are paid and funded by the same supposed corrupt gov'ts wouldn't lie.

Gotcha.

[phishtaper]

nibbler, to question Dr. Butler-Jones' integrity and competency based on a photograph is perhaps the stupidest thing ive seen tingle off your fingertips here (and you have typed some incredibly stupid things). he is considered to be one of the top population health physicians/researchers in the world ... by those actually qualified to judge, unlike you.

but please, do humour the rest of us and explain how this man's income is "connected to the wolves bank account". i eagerly await an imbedded link to yet another wackjob's website.

[nibbler]

"Real knowledge is to know the extent of one's own ignorance."

Said by a dude named Confucius, about 2500 years ago

[phishtaper]

are you drunk?

[ollie]

Something about his aura of un-healthiness makes me weary of taking health and medical advice from this cat:

Good point.

[Kanada Kev]

i eagerly await an imbedded link to yet another wackjob's website.

HEY! Who you callin' "wackjob"?

According to Horowitz, human beings are fundamentally "digital, bioholographic, precipitations, crystallizations, miraculous manifestations of Divine frequency vibrations" rendered hydrosonically and metaphysically.(7) The authors suggest two main factors determine efficacy of electrotherapy systems including chakra-based tuning systems: 1) the heart-felt loving intent of the therapist as well as the patient. This relates to investigations of prayer associated with beneficial outcomes best explained by theories in quantum physics, creative consciousness, and creationistic metaphysics;(6) and 2) the actual frequencies used.

[Esau.]

Yeah, I guess anyone with a heavier build is unhealthy. Out of curiosity, what is his current state of health? I ask because I have absolutely no idea.

"Ignorance is the night of the mind, but a night without moon and star."

Confucius

[nibbler]

the so called "crazy people" seem to think that powerful interests with ridiculous amounts of money are able to effectively distort the findings of science to fatten their bank accounts... how crazy is that!

A strangely under reported news in recent years was the pharmaceutical industry crossing the proverbial 'we are too big to fail' threshold: i.e. when for the first time in history, the industry as a whole generated yearly revenues of over one trillion dollars.

( thats $1,000,000,000,000! ) - forbes.com

Over a trillion ranks big Pharm fifth in the top five list of global industries by revenue today, trailing behind only the Financial, Telecommunications, Automotive, and of course the big one- the Oil and Gas industry. - forbes.com

Unlike the worlds' other big four, the Pharma industry has sailed through the 'economic downturn' without any obvious handouts or subsidization. - forbes.com

[SaggyBalls]

No shot no GBS.

Vaccinations are not the cause of the syndrome' date=' just a possible trigger. Having surgery or getting sick (flu, cold etc) have also been linked as possible triggers. GBS can affect anybody. Saying "no shot no GBS" is nothing more then ignorance.[/quote']

So...if you don't trigger the syndrome from starting then can you suffer from it? Nope. I don't see that as ignorance. I wasn't talking about the CAUSE but the ONSET.

How easy it is to point the finger of ignorance at someone whose stance on an issue is questionable in the eyes of established opinion and practice.

[SaggyBalls]

health canada has concluded that you are much more likely to develop GBS from having the flu than from getting the flu shot

No shot no GBS.

So' date=' who's right?

[/quote']

Do you really care who's right? Would it really change or firm up your position on the matter?

[Esau.]

So...if you don't trigger the syndrome from starting then can you suffer from it? Nope. I don't see that as ignorance. I wasn't talking about the CAUSE but the ONSET.

Yes, you can. GBS can be sudden and unexpected as well.

How easy it is to point the finger of ignorance at someone whose stance on an issue is questionable in the eyes of established opinion and practice.

Not pointing any fingers here. Your opinion on the topic of vaccinations doesn't really play into it (at least for me). It's ignorant (eg: ill-informed) to say "no shot/no gbs", I'm sorry you can't grasp that. It's no different then claiming "no cigarettes, no cancer" .

[SaggyBalls]

in this instance the trigger was the shot.

Maybe later on it would get triggered by something else, but if that's the case they'd probably have had a rather normal holiday season.

It's not like saying 'no cigarettes no lung cancer'.

Edited December 23, 2009 by Guest

[Freak By Night]

I said I was going to get the H1N1 shot, but it was just too inconvenient for me.

I did not get the shot, and did not get the flu.

[color:purple]Therefore, the vaccine doesn't work.

[Schwa.]

no shot, no flu.

see ya next week.

[Jakis]

I have never got the flu shot and haven't gotten the flu in over 5 years and I work at a hospital. I am just so healthy! lol, watch me get the flu this weekend now.

[SaggyBalls]

(NaturalNews) In conjunction with NaturalNews, the non-profit Consumer Wellness Center (www.ConsumerWellness.org) has publicly offered a $10,000 reward for any person, company or institution who can provide trusted, scientific evidence proving that any of the FDA-approved H1N1 vaccines being offered to Americans right now are both safe and effective.

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