H1N1 - To Vaccinate or Not to Vaccinate

[jayr]

Are any of you with children honestly not gonna let them get the vaccine because of some extremely hard to prove conspiracy?

I hold the right to have a say in what the Government and media decide should be injected into my daughters blood stream very dear as I'm sure you do as well. Conspiracy has nothing to do with it. It's a personal choice, just like it would be if I were to want her to get the shot.

[SaggyBalls]

Conspiracy has nothing to do with it. It's a personal choice, just like it would be if I were to want her to get the shot.

Sounds fair to me.

[nibbler]

Don't let them mock you into silence nibbler, I appreciate your point of view.

Ollie,

Thanks- that was unnecessary but still nice to hear.

Silence Nibbler? Fear not. As truth advocate and peace, environmental, human rights and animal rights activist blended into one, rest assured I have heard the ship of fools' laughter many times before...

I have seen small victories in my time, which is more than enough to stoke my hopes and keep me engaged in these 'unwinnable' battles in an era of psychopathic corporatocracy rules.

[Tricky]

All this talk about being able to protect yourself and not needing any vaccine is all fine and dandy until you factor your kids into it. They go to school, basically breath each other's snot, and pass around colds like they're going out of style. Are any of you with children honestly not gonna let them get the vaccine because of some extremely hard to prove conspiracy? I had a friend tell me the other day he doesn't envy me for having to make this decision. What decision?! It's not like were living in the 18th century people...or the 1950's for that matter. But thanks for making the decision to protect my 5 yr old from a life threatening illness slightly more complicated than it ever needed to be.

I'm not getting the shots for my kids. Things seem pretty obvious after talking to my doctor and doing a little research.

[ollie]

Thanks- that was unnecessary but still nice to hear.

Heh, heh, no problem. I admit I was being a tad melodramatic.

[Booche]

Swine flu vaccination clinics in Ottawa will temporarily close at the end of Thursday because there is not enough vaccine, the Ottawa Public Health department announced Wednesday.

In other related news, I have an Ottawa wristband for sale and is good for this afternoon starting at 2pm. Serious inquiries only. PM me with money offers now!

[phishtaper]

Swine flu vaccination clinics in Ottawa will temporarily close at the end of Thursday because there is not enough vaccine' date=' the Ottawa Public Health department announced Wednesday.[/quote']

In other related news, I have an Ottawa wristband for sale and is good for this afternoon starting at 2pm. Serious inquiries only. PM me with money offers now!

[color:purple]that's sexy

[phishtaper]

so, the wizards in Guelph had the h1n1 clinic at an awkward location that required people to park on the street. then during the first few clinics early last week while hundreds of people were lined up for hours, they went around and gave everyone parking tickets. claaaaaasy.

[Esau.]

so, the wizards in Guelph had the h1n1 clinic at an awkward location that required people to park on the street. then during the first few clinics early last week while hundreds of people were lined up for hours, they went around and gave everyone parking tickets. claaaaaasy.

wow

This has all been one big clusterfuck since the get go.

[nibbler]

"Neurological disorders temporally associated with influenza vaccination such as

encephalopathy, optic neuritis/neuropathy, partial facial paralysis, and brachial plexus

neuropathy have been reported.

Microscopic polyangiitis (vasculitis) has been reported temporally associated with

influenza vaccination....

Neither FLUVIRIN nor the Influenza A (H1N1) 2009 Monovalent Vaccine have

been evaluated for carcinogenic or mutagenic potential, or for impairment of fertility.....

"

Those are excerpts from the infosheet which shipped with the Novartis version of the 2009 H1N1 vaccine.

[Kanada Kev]

[color:purple]Nibbler, YES please keep sending this quality research material from the #1 site when it comes to flu knowledge!!

http://www.jambands.ca/sanctuary/showpost.php?post/621086/

Are you "Dr." Horowiz's love child or something?

Edited November 22, 2009 by Guest

[Esau.]

I haven't had a flu shot in over ten years, to me it's a personal choice. I don't feel that our gov't is trying to kill us, but I don't feel I need it. Yet last night I had two people go on and on about how I shouldn't get get it.

This is the gist of one the conversations:

[color:red]Me: So, did you get the flu shot?

Friend: No, and I hope you haven't decided to infect yourself with it.

[color:red]Me: nah, I haven't a flu shot in years

Friend: Well, let me tell you why you shouldn't get it

[color:red]Me: That's ok, I've done a bunch of reading, and it doesn't matter I haven't and won't get it.

Friend: No seriously, listen to this <5 or so minutes of telling me things I've already read>

[color:red]Me: Like I said, I won't be getting it

Friend: But, really man, if you educate yourself you'll understand why its not a good idea to get it

[color:red]Me: I understand, it's bad, got it

Friend: Its your choice man, if you want to kill yourself <more about why it will hurt me>

This seems to be the average listening ability of many people when it comes to this stuff. I think the thing I'm sick of the most about this whole H1N1 deal is the people who have this uncontrollable need to be the experts or convince others of their opinions.

I mean, ok, thanks for the links, the email or reading material but honestly both sides can provide equal amounts of so called "proof" why we should or shouldn't get the shot. A lot seems to have some merit (conspiracy b.s excluded), like the girl who got the shot and is now messed up or the boy who died from H1N1, both cases are sad and scary but at the same time they are not the majority.

The best advice I got before starting my cancer ordeal years ago was, educate yourself, know and understand your current state of health, your and your family health history, talk to your doctor, know the risks (both sides), get a second opinion if you need/want and make your decision. I feel this applies to everything when in comes to our health.

[nibbler]

I don't see how the natural health products advertised on Dr Horowitz' site would discredit the mirrored PDF of the H1N1 vaccine safety infosheet provided by the vaccine manufacturer?

[nibbler]

I haven't had a flu shot in over ten years, to me it's a personal choice. I don't feel that our gov't is trying to kill us, but I don't feel I need it.

Kill us? heck no! A sick and dependent customer base is far more profitable to the Medical establishment than a dead one.

The best advice I got before starting my cancer ordeal years ago was, educate yourself, know and understand your current state of health, your and your family health history, talk to your doctor, know the risks (both sides), get a second opinion if you need/want and make your decision. I feel this applies to everything when in comes to our health.

Agreed. Though I would put forth that there are more than two "sides" to medical stories. After all, if doctors always told us the truth about the pills they perscribed- the "placebo" effect wouldn't have been discovered. I would think that reading the info sheet that ships with a medication is the least one should do before injecting it directly into one's blood:

Neither FLUVIRIN nor the Influenza A (H1N1) 2009 Monovalent Vaccine have

been evaluated for carcinogenic or mutagenic potential, or for impairment of fertility.

Edited November 23, 2009 by Guest

[Esau.]

Kill us? heck no! A sick and dependent customer base is far more profitable to the Medical establishment than a dead one.

I don't believe that, but the same could easily be said about the natural health product market.

Agreed. Though I would put forth that there are more than two "sides" to medical stories. After all, if doctors always told us the truth about the pills they perscribed- the "placebo" effect wouldn't have been discovered. I would think that reading the info sheet that ships with a medication is the least one should do before injecting it directly into one's blood:

Neither FLUVIRIN nor the Influenza A (H1N1) 2009 Monovalent Vaccine have

been evaluated for carcinogenic or mutagenic potential, or for impairment of fertility.

No offense, but what gave you the impression I haven't read what you have already posted? This sorta backs up my earlier point about the average listening ability to be honest.

[Velvet]

Esau, your last two posts (at least) were excellent.

[bONES]

a student of mine came in very late to class on Saturday.

She went out drinking on the Friday evening she said and caught the wine flu the next day...poor girl

[nibbler]

I don't believe that, but the same could easily be said about the natural health product market.

No need trying to convince me- the Tofu Mafia will also benefit from and propagate the scare conceived by the Medical Mafia.

No offense, but what gave you the impression I haven't read what you have already posted? This sorta backs up my earlier point about the average listening ability to be honest.

I'm not under that impression.

Perhaps I thought that by *Jaydawgging* it, I would draw more attention to such a startling piece of info:

You must admit- considering all the side effects they do monitor for- its odd that they haven't tested their flu vaccines over the years for "carcinogenic or mutagenic potential, or for impairment of fertility."...

[AD]

Maybe if you italicize it next time...

[Esau.]

It wasn't an attempt to convince you of anything actually. But, it could easily be said that it's more profitable for Horowitz and the like to say otherwise as well.

As far as I am concerned, saying doctors and the medical community purposely keep people sick to make more money is like saying undertakers cause a certain percentage of all deaths so they stay in business. Short of living in a glove and mask, sterile, hepa-filtered, germ free bio-dome people are always going to get sick and need medical attention.

I'll admit I don't know enough to give any educated statements about the vaccine, its effects, pros or cons, even after reading so much about it. Since I have no schooling in any medical field I can only hope the sources and reference material I read are being presented legitimately and fairly from either side. Honestly though, after looking at the fluscam website, all I see is fear mongering much like the way the media/gov't has portrayed H1N1, but just from the opposite angle.

Personally, when I need medical information I'll look to an MD, not a dentist with a degree in health studies who thinks aids and ebola are gov't made bio-weapons.

[Hal Johnson]

Esau, your last two posts (at least) were excellent.

make it three.

[AD]

that stupid video plays automatically and it's so fucking annoying

[nibbler]

no kidding- Horowitz' video pwnz *Jaydawgging*

Thanks to the collective skanks who bumped us onto the twelfth page- you only have to watch it if you want to now.

Edited December 7, 2009 by Guest

[ollie]

Batch of H1N1 vaccine pulled

Manitoba notices spike in severe allergic reactions

The Canadian Press

Health officials across Canada are being asked to hold back a batch of swine flu vaccine that appears to be causing higher rates of severe allergic reactions.

The vaccine's manufacturer, GlaxoSmithKline, is asking governments to stop using vaccine doses from one particular lot shipment issued in late October.

The company says it's a cautionary move, pending an investigation.

Manitoba health officials say they have noticed severe allergic reactions from the batch in question at a rate of one in 20,000.

That's much higher than the normal rate of one in 100,000.

The Alberta government is also holding back the same batch of vaccine, although it says it has not seen a jump in allergic reactions.

Manitoba's chief medical officer of health, Dr. Joel Kettner, says he wants to assure people that the risk of any adverse effects from the vaccine is very low.

Health officials say the batch being investigated is fairly small, so it should not have an impact on the overall supply.

http://www.cbc.ca/health/story/2009/11/19/man-cp-flu-vaccine-hold.html

[localcrew]

A few interesting lines from an article

...the leaflet also says four of 253 people studied experienced “severe adverse reactionsâ€. Three of the four were deemed to be unrelated to the vaccine, but one case of hypersensitivity (which can mean anything from an allergic reaction to autoimmune disease) was determined “to be related to vaccinationâ€.

That one serious reaction might not sound like a lot, but it actually translates into a rate of 395 cases per 100,000 people. That’s more than 50 times the rate of hospitalization due to H1N1 itself: 7.3 per 100,000 Canadians.

btw this is not related to the batch of vaccine mentioned in the above article but general h1n1 vaccine testing.

Edited November 26, 2009 by Guest