Thumpin Posted July 17, 2003 Report Share Posted July 17, 2003 Kung, usually I really enjoy your posts for their wit, cynicism and insight--not to mention general shit-disturbing--but you're last one was lacking. I want to hear you back those comments up. Why is Cully "the man"? Why is Wassabi a cult? And the big one...What do you have against them? This thread is about the loss of an Eastern festival that is making quite a name for itself across the country, someone wants to blame it on one band, I was expecting that you would be one of the first to call bullshit, or is your personal relationship with "the Cully" interfering with your integrity as a journalist Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
secondtube Posted July 17, 2003 Report Share Posted July 17, 2003 quote: or is your personal relationship with "the Cully" interfering with your integrity as a journalist I guess quote: Cully is the man in their relationship. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kung Posted July 17, 2003 Report Share Posted July 17, 2003 Come on SecondTube that is such shite. Your personal relationship clouds your judgment or affects it all the time- Steeltown proud. I can't even swallow that for a second. Such a load. As to AC/DC's legit question I have spoken up against what I call 'grey market' festivals before. All of our festivals are not run above board, many are funded by drug proceeds, aren't even prepared for inclement weather let alone tragedy, moreover there is inadequite preparation to deal with health emergencies. This is my business or at least an area I know alot about- I would not feel comfortable running a festival like Come Together or Evolve, I couldn't live with myself if something went wrong. I definitely would not want to have a heart attack at Frontier Town, defib paddles anyone? Fuck I'd take a dude who knows CPR and a 'booboo' kit - which I'm sure is about all they have up there (did I mention a sobre dude who knows CPR). Oh yeah what was your question again? What do I have against Wassabi? I just think they're lame back woods freak shows is that clear enough. There music I don't like, they generally freaked me out with their culty weirdness, they scared me, they had that hippy smell.... Is that enough? As for Cully and I we have some personal history but were never that tight and see a bit more of one another recently. We've often disagreed about shit in the past as I recall such as the Burt Neilson, or peoples perception that I 'harshed on them'. Of course when they kicked Kornbloom out of the band allegiances scattered many in his aid. I trust his opinion and respect his words. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
secondtube Posted July 17, 2003 Report Share Posted July 17, 2003 no, i call that a 'bully' baiting on a silly hippy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 17, 2003 Report Share Posted July 17, 2003 I have been attending this festival for four years now. Okay, so my personal smell may have brought the cops???ACDC or whatever, who the .... are you? Are you the man? (or women...sorry) Oh...I could go and say something stupid like I have been on this scene since you were sucking on yo momas tit, but that would be childish/stupid (wouldn't it?!?) THE COPS CAME BECAUSE OF A NOISE COMPLAINT, DO I HAVE TO MAKE THIS ANY CLEARER........THEY ALMOST BUSTED SOME OF MY GOOD FRIENDS BECAUSE OF THIS!!!) Oh yeah, I love music festivals....raves, dances, box car socials, whatever you want to call it. I have nothing against drums, just some who bang on them........and I do support Canadian bands....only good ones........honestly have you guys who are such big fans ever listened to two of W. shows back to back? IT IS THE SAME SHOW EVERY NIGHT! IT MAY BE GOOD BUT IT WILL NOT BE AROUND FOR TOO LONG IF THEY DON'T CHANGE IT UP A LITTLE....trust me....I have already gone through one break up with BURT. But back to the Town....it is sad, but i guess that is was bound to happen....first it was the nitrous noise that was getting noise complaints (no joke)...and now the excessive drums....hopefully something can be worked out. Peace and Love to all that matter.......you know who you are..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Schwa. Posted July 17, 2003 Report Share Posted July 17, 2003 any thoughts on this MK? We talked a bit about the things Mung mentioned and i find them all very valid. (for once ) Frontier Town is a fucking blast, but it is NOT organized. It could be best described as a field with a stage and a mud dancefloor (slanted at that) I've had some kick ass times there in the past but improvements need to be made. (Sound, emergency services, that little puke that came around Monday morning drunk as fuck on the golf cart - 12 yrs old at best) The food was great this past year, but its hidden in a little cabin back in the corner. Put Frontier Town on display. The trailer that Metalwood played on at the jazzfest was a great stage and was about 4 times the size of the stage at FT. Why don't we start there? There is HUGE potential for Vending and yet it is not pursued. Is this the best that the most heavily populated province has to offer? What does that say about us? I think it just shows our inexperience. OK i'm ranting. Sorry. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
secondtube Posted July 17, 2003 Report Share Posted July 17, 2003 hmmm, i've always kinda liked the 'unorganized' feel to frontier town. of course, the SAFETY and SOUND issues must be addressed. I could care less about the rest. I'm an adult. I can take care of myself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 17, 2003 Report Share Posted July 17, 2003 This is not Adam Culliford posting, but someone using my login who has been there since the beginning.....five years ago......who has something intelligent to say about the issue........ Hi everyone, I couldn't just stand by reading this anymore without offering a little input. As someone who has been there from the beginning, I know you all think you have but your wrong! I'm talking 30 people and the mark wilson band. When the cooler older frontier town folks still went and I now its huge! I know you all think its wonderful that the this festival is making a name for itself all over the country but that is precisley the problem! It was never meant to get that big and now it's over! No matter what kinda of peace lovin people are at a festival, the more people the more direspectful idiots. I know it seems like the middle of nowhere but its not!! what do you think is on the other side of that forest? the sound carries enormously! especially loud bass noises. Why do you think the last band of the night plays in the saloon??? so wassibi can have their drum circle??? use your brains!!! It s a private place and we should not be spreading the word about frontier town we should be keeping it hush! sorry to the people who didn't get to go! As for supporting our canadian bands I'm all for it but not for ten bucks at pepper jacks! they tour here to take your money! and they're laughing at you. 10 bucks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paisley Posted July 17, 2003 Report Share Posted July 17, 2003 frontier has gone from a few hundred people to over a thousand... I would say it needs to be adjusted, not shut down... definately needs a more visible first aid and better sound... as for the growing crowd getting worse I actually have found the people there this year a lot mellower and friendlier than last year wassabi played on the streets in Victoria for about a year for fun and started gathering some big crowds... after that bar owners said come play for us... a few years of that and they went on their first tour last year the hamilton show was sold out past capacity at $10... as the show the next night in toronto was only $6 I don't think the band was entirely responsible for charging $10 in hamilton... the first time I saw them a year before in hamilton it was $2 and there were 20 people there... they got popular, the room is only so big... the price went up so mostly people who really wanted to see the band would attend... to talk to the band they just want to be able to pay for gas, food and lodging and anything extra is going into the new CD like I said, it was their first time at the CTMF... if Rick or Mark Wilson had've come over to the fire and said "hey, its too late to be drumming outside" I'm sure they would've apologized and toned it down... how does playing for free all night at a fire fit into the cash grab? *edit * touring coast to coast without outside financing and no real promotion besides word of mouth doesn't usually get people too rich (at least not rich enough to laugh at the people who paid to see them) my only complaint about the last few times I saw wassabi is there wasn't enough room to dance (ended up behind the fire at frontier and outside at pepperjacks when I don't like a band I usually just don't go to their shows oh and I guess one more rule could be put in at Frontier which'd be no more drum kits at the fire (though I did enjoy going back and forth between there and the saloon that one time) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
secondtube Posted July 17, 2003 Report Share Posted July 17, 2003 quote: When the cooler older frontier town folks still went and I now its huge! Dude, there are so many things wrong with that statement. I've been there from the first frontier town, and never missed a single one. But i'm not 'cooler older folk', as i got a boo urns for being me, in another thread. Secondly, just because you found out about it first doesn't make you any better or worse than someone who just went up for their first time. I've met so many cool people that were there for their first time.... I personally like it more when there are more fans than band members, which took at least a year and a half to happen. The first two frontier towns had around 30 people, and almost as many band members... that certainly didn't make it better... Neither did hearing Burt play for close to five hours on Saturday night because there just wasn't another band on the bill...what made it cool was the fact that we were all together as 'one'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaggyBalls Posted July 17, 2003 Report Share Posted July 17, 2003 you know what...theis whole wassabi thing is silly. sure you don't like them for your own reasons but a lot of people like them they're not a seasoned band and have material they don't like to stray from. I'vbe sensed a similar vibe from all of their shows but they're cool folks that like to party and bring good times. i think a 10 dollar show should be reserved for the bands that tour and are making a difference on the scene, not just a band that's happened into it...even though they have more tour costs than say nero or grand theft bus. i like their shows but never leave feeling that special feeling that those guys get into me. i'd pay 10 bucks gleefully to see antibalas though...big band but then again...not a jamband so i guess i'm a hypocrite...but i agree with the drum circle thing. i was playing in it a lot of the time but it should've been up the hill. I still think the neighbours shoulda called rick. that's just silly. I think it's grown too big but if we can find a suitable property to party on farther away from people then i say let's do it. We just need to tell people that already go to shows. that's about it. sure it'll be snobby for awhile but when it's big enough to get bigger then ti'll explode and measures will be in place to support that. we don't need anything to go wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MK Posted July 17, 2003 Report Share Posted July 17, 2003 Thoughts on Frontier Town? Christ, I've been there from the start - being form Brantford and all...being a fan of the music doesn't hurt either...over the last two years though it seems pretty clear that the music was on the low end of the priority scale. No effort (or spending) on the bands...less than no effort on the production (2-4 this year saw the 'sound crew' digging a trench for the snake like an hour after show time - this crew generally isn't assembled until minutes before kick-off either)...more attention is definitely paid to the party - I didn't make it up for Canada Day but noone I talked to could give any feedback on the music...just the drugs... If any one has been to ANY other festival it is apparent that FT totally lacks in ALL departments (except the unabashed partying) and has total room for improvement in all areas (this whole getting shut-down thing is absolutley no surprise)...sponsorship is neccesary in any event - this is a very appealing market to nearly every beer and cigarette company and the dollars needed to make this scene fly are cents to the big boys. Money, as evil as it is, makes the world go round - not volunteers and unqualified dudes working for beer or a cot in a cabin...if there were people getting paid, things would run smoothly, if money making oppurtunities were explored (merch, food, vending, archiving) there would be way more vested interest in having things run right rather than the fly-by-night cash-cow for a couple of individuals that FT is. Objectively, FT sums everything that is sneered at about the scene - sketch city. Not for the kids or the straight-edged, not for the curious or the uninitiated, 100% for the indulgent user (me for one) and the wide-open minded. Unfortunatly FT IS the scene. In no other place does it actually become tangible. I understand why everyone holds a flame for it - but maybe it's time the scene grew up and into something 'legit'...we'll see if the cards get folded and who gets dealt the next hand... maybe start here Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jared Posted July 17, 2003 Author Report Share Posted July 17, 2003 not to be a bun or disrespectifiul to anyone. but, i toatally argee with most of the coments you all are making. i agree it was bound to happen, and i agree that many things needed to be improved at FT. however, i think that instead of bashing people and bands and stuff we should all focous our creative energy on finding a way to help get FT open again. and if thats not feasible then we should focous on getting a new fest going. that would be a good idea for some one who wants to make a buck, take it upon your self to organise a party and i'm sure you could get the 1000+ crowd there in the fist year. also i think if everyone had all theres com[laints and sugestions then why are they all coming out now? this stuff could have beren put to good use while there still was a festival. finally i think that alot will be done to re open frontier town,, weather its official or just for firends, but that place was ricks lively hood and he built it all by hand,, i'm sure he will do what ever is nessary to re open as soon as possable cause we wern't the only people who used the place. and i'm sure he doesn't want to go broke as far as sponsership i think that would be a great idea. i'm sure pure hemp would love to kick in some cash for advertising and other stuff, as well and local resturants and shops and as for all the peopel saying that alot of money can be made at frontier town,, i'd have to say no way, this canada day everything included for 3 days of veding i made only 65 dollars,, i didn't even cover my ticket gas or the bong i gave away, in fact that weekend still cost me over 300 dollars. so i'd have to say booo to that Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jared Posted July 17, 2003 Author Report Share Posted July 17, 2003 ok,,, i hear from my inside sourses that marks official stance is it has nothing to do with him, the matter is between rick and the city, mark was just renting the camp grounds,, so if you have coments or sugestions or want to help take it up with rick. also nothing official about labourday has been posted so keep your fingeers crossed cause RICK is doing everything possable Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Schwa. Posted July 17, 2003 Report Share Posted July 17, 2003 I don't want to imply that the festival should become commercial. Just raise a little more money so that more money can be put back into it and it will flourish. It should remain there, i think its a beautiful place, but with more exposure, the extra $$ that the township is asking would be a joke, pay them and everyones happy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jared Posted July 17, 2003 Author Report Share Posted July 17, 2003 pay them and everyone is happy, would be great but rick doesn;t think that he will ever be able to make up the diffrence, and we can't blame him for that,, iu don't think he wants to do anything that is going to end up costing him more then he can make, and as for the drunk kid driving around i know that kid and he is ricks nephew, and he is 16, he just looks really young, he tryed to buy a pipe off me and i said no cause i felt wrong,, but he is drfinalty older then some of the other people i met there who just look older then there age Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Musicface Posted July 17, 2003 Report Share Posted July 17, 2003 quote:however, i think that instead of bashing people and bands and stuff we should all focous our creative energy on finding a way to help get FT open again. and if thats not feasible then we should focous on getting a new fest going.Here, here! Things change, people can whine about the good old days or whatever, but you can't go home. Things grow or they die, that's the way life works for everything on the planet folks. If some folks are content to let it die, that's their business. Personally I'd like to be on the side fighting to have something good come out off all this, whatever that ends up being. If Mark Wilson's saying Rick should deal with it, we should do what we can to support Rick if he wants us to. If anyone is in touch with him and could get him or a representative to post something here, then we can move forward from there. Meanwhile for August, personally I'd still love to play that weekend and see some of ya all 'cus that's how I wanted to spend my long weekend! I'm going into a few days of playing and travel, but if anyone has any ideas about if it's possible to make something happen, post away! Again I'm personally happy to pitch in however I can. Peace, Mr. M. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Musicface Posted July 17, 2003 Report Share Posted July 17, 2003 P.S. This is a lot cornier than I usually get in my posts, but hey, I'm a songwriter so that's how I express myself. I wrote this after I got back from May 2-4, and I hoped my band could play it at Frontier Town for August. I still hope to play it there someday, I guess we'll see. In the meantime, here's the lyrics for your consideration: Frontier Well I've got this burning deep inside of me And I've got to find a place where it can be set free So I'll dance and sing in just a little while Where I gather with the others who can feel that fire Well I drive for hours through the pouring rain I will travel on through places that I can't explain When I reach the gatepost with the faded signs Where my sisters and my brothers all will soon arrive And in the place we gather magic, music makes the world seem clear Dancing where we come together - out on the frontier Well I read your words almost every day But I hardly ever see you so I'd like to say You're a good good friend, and you're real to me And it's fine to be together in this sanctuary And in the place we gather magic, music makes the world seem clear Dancing where we come together - out on the frontier Well like all good things well these days must end But it won't be long until the songs are played again And until that time, we'll be close and true And the distance doesn't matter now for me and you And in the place we gather magic, music makes the world seem clear Dancing where we come together - out on the frontier Seeya soon my friends, - M. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
show---whore Posted July 17, 2003 Report Share Posted July 17, 2003 Interesting Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phishin4mango Posted July 17, 2003 Report Share Posted July 17, 2003 i'd say!! i have so much to say about this topic, but i don't dare, out of fear of getting shot!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Super Freak Posted July 17, 2003 Report Share Posted July 17, 2003 OK I'm the "secret source" and I need to re-tell Jared's version, cause it's off abit and I didn't think he was going to post it. I said before on this thread that I would get Mark to post an official run down of the situation when he gets things figured out. These official, so to speak, postsusually come through me or Mark Tonin. This, by no means, is an "official" Frontier Town post. All Mark said to me was, something to this affect; "I'm not sure what's happening with it all.I think Rick has to take care of a few things dealing with the property". Something like that anyway, we were just shooting the sh#t, we weren't talking Frontier Town business. That's it. I didn't say "take it up with Rick" or any of the other ad libs. And I sure did not say it was official. Sorry to disappoint I am quite sure we will all be told everything we need/want to know, as soon as there is something to tell. I know the waiting is the hardest part. Sorry I couldn't resist... Sit tight Y'all!!! P.S. Purple monkey dishwasher...pass it on... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jared Posted July 17, 2003 Author Report Share Posted July 17, 2003 i did not mean to miss represent anyone. what i ment was that it really comes down to it being ricks problum so if anyone has any advise or sugestions, or wants to find out exactly what we can do to hepl then rick is the guy to talk to, he runs the place, mark only rents it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Super Freak Posted July 17, 2003 Report Share Posted July 17, 2003 Jared, I understand your opinion but you're also making a few assumptions. I worked with Mark and I don't know all the inside workings of what goes on between Mark and Rick as far as business/frontier town goes. Just wait and see what happens, I'm sure we'll know soon enough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AdamH Posted July 17, 2003 Report Share Posted July 17, 2003 Today I've had the good fortune of chiming in on things at the right time, such as just after a post about yo mama's tit Evolve and the CTMF were fun and disorganized. I agree Kung, I wouldn't want me or a loved one to fall ill at one of these events because the emergency procedures are insufficient. Maybe having on-site triage is too cost prohibitive, but what about a chill-out center for all the bad trippers we encounter? Having that in place might prevent some of the incidents that happened at Evolve and at CTMF. Perhaps personal responsibility just falls to the waiver we all sign on the way in, but when something does happen and it's not dealt with adequately it marks the end of that particular venue and leaves a negative impression on the attendees and the bands that played there. What irks me even more is that the festival community generates a ridiculous amount of waste and feels no responsibility to clean up there own mess. Somehow our ecological footprint triples in size when we're groovin' and ridin' that E high. CTMF was average but Evolve was atrocious, and I know that weather probably spurred people to vacate as fast as possible but I got the feeling that the promoters and organizers had left the scene before the attendees. Recycling, reusable plates and cutlery, food waste diversion for composting...these are things we do in our homes and should be capable of doing anywhere else. Not only does it demontrate environmental responsibility, it demonstrates a general responsibility that allows a festival such as evolve to continue using a site that suits them. In this case, the Town of Durham could see that CTMFs impact is a fraction of, say a double bill Motorhead/Iron Maiden festival might have (Ace of Spades!) Access to plenty of clean drinking water, clean sanitation facilities, on-site health staff, even security...I want all of those things, and I'd pay $50 instead of $40 for it. There's another angle to all of this that we're overlooking. For us to continue drawing U.S. bands like the Slip up to Canada, we have to demonstrate that: 1. There exists a market for their music, 2. They'll be treated and received well by promoters and audience alike 3. They will receive positive media exposure playing here 4. They'll be booked into venues and festivals that they'll want to play at again. So for the sake of encouraging bands of that calibre to dump stashes and cross the border we need to look at how we a run tings. Lastly, as far as the May 24 CTMF is concerned, it's not being shut down because of Wassabi, it's being shut down because of the above, because of the taxation issues that many have mentioned, a certain hand smashing a certain windshield resulting in a certain police report, and apparently a track record of incidents which endanger the citizens of Durham and cast a terrible light on the organizers. Seems reasonable enough to me. Those of you who want to do a weekend research project on how to run a festival should attend the Hillside Festival in Guelph next weekend. It proves that all of the above, with a little organization and alot of effort on the part of volunteers, you can put on an eco-conscious, truly mind-expanding festival that introduces people to big acts AND emerging acts AND exciting musical collaborations (do you truly love improvised music? This is what you want) festival and get fucking Burning Spear to play outside a town of 100 000! P.S. I didn't like Wassabi either Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jared Posted July 17, 2003 Author Report Share Posted July 17, 2003 you got any info on the hillside fest? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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