US Foreign Policy

[MarcO]

I would like to invade Brooke Burke and Scarlett Johannsen. There, I said it.

[Dr_Evil_Mouse]

Once Castro kicks the bucket I'd give it a maximum of 12 months before the US makes a move.

I'd take that bet, or some variant thereof. What's that line about the centre not being able to hold and mere anarchy being loosed upon the world? Think Yugoslavia without Tito, or the Dead without Jerry [there, now this thread has music content]. Think the Pentagon being the wolf casing out the herd of deer waiting for the weakest to fall behind.

[timouse]

Once Castro kicks the bucket I'd give it a maximum of 12 months before the US makes a move.

I'd take that bet' date=' or some variant thereof. What's that line about the centre not being able to hold and mere anarchy being loosed upon the world? Think Yugoslavia without Tito, or the Dead without Jerry [there, now this thread has music content']. Think the Pentagon being the wolf casing out the herd of deer waiting for the weakest to fall behind.

the wolf's already got the herd cased...they're hiding over in the trees putting napkins around their necks and marco, i would imagine that invading brooke burke would be like throwing a hotdog down a hallway (thank you family guy!!)

[Biggest Fan]

It seems that there might be some agreement with the US Anti-Castro policy as being the biggest foreign policy blunder.

#2 Vietnam (war)- Funny enough with France being our partner in crime in this debacle.

#3 I am going to save for a minute only because it might need it own blog just to explain.

#4 Central America- The US has been messing up in this part of the world for to long. I am not sure we done one right thing yet.

#5 Iraq War (DSII) There is one thing that I really do not understand (and no I am not tyring to start an arguement or open up Pandora's Box), if your not an American or one of the allies in the war then why is it such a big deal. It is our young men and women who are dying and it is our tax dollars being spent. **If you think about it we make you guys look pretty good.

[MarcO]

There is one thing that I really do not understand (and no I am not tyring to start an arguement or open up Pandora's Box), if your not an American or one of the allies in the war then why is it such a big deal. It is our young men and women who are dying and it is our tax dollars being spent. **If you think about it we make you guys look pretty good.

Because when it comes to war on this kind of scale and intent, it engages us as members of the world community whether we are actively involved or not. Besides, some of us are simply appalled by war and cannot sit idly by with no concern or opinion. The actions of the US Administration against Iraq do not exist in a bubble, only of concern to those actively involved in it.

[Im going home Donny]

I would love to understand why so many Americans can't seem to understand that this planet we live on should be seen as a whole-holisticly. 'Americans' fucking 'one' place affects the whole place. Thats simple isn't it?

[Biggest Fan]

I am trying to figure out a way to shut Ms. Pandora's Box. I have no problem in a person being a pacifist. In fact I believe very strongly in the resolution of conflicts through peaceful means. The wise man is able to use his brain to resolve problems, the bully his brawn.

I have heard many Americans speak of the needless deaths, the money spent unwisely, and gosh knows our allies (England, Spain ,etc) have every right to argue over the war.

I see this war much like the 'spiritual' nature of the lotus flower. We know the muck that surrounds this war. The support of Sadam against Iran, the lies as to why the war started, the questions that still are a part of the war, etc...

I still believe that among this muck a flower can grow. There is chance that a sovereign nation, with a constitution that represents the wishes of the people could happen. I know it is a stretch but it would be an impressive flower if it came to pass. I believe that many Americans think the same way as me. You cannot be happy with the events that surround this war but what if...

[MarcO]

so on the one hand you can't figure out why countries not involved in the war would want to even care about it, and on the other you can see why the US would invade a country (that was not a threat to them) instead of just leaving it be.

"What if......" - what if, what?!? Thousands of US & allied troops and tens of thousands of Iraqi citizens have their precious lives taken away from them in order to plant some loving seed of democracy that your country's administries professes to hold so dear?

I won't have the wool pulled over my eyes. This war is not about bringing democracy to some poor nation so one day we can revel in the love together, all happy and free.

[MarcO]

and if you don't want to start an argument or open "pandora's box", why do you create threads regarding US foreign policy?

[Freeker]

Because he's an idiot...either that or an irritating alter-ego of someone on the board.

[Biggest Fan]

Believe me, I thought twice about bringing Iraq into the conversation. I can only say that I 'pray' something good comes of this mess. As I said this now stands as #5 on my list of foreign policy blunders. If nothing good comes of this I would most definitely have to change the order.

To put it on the books I have never made an arguement nor do I believe that we had any right to "invade" Iraq. In fact it is a bit of a joke in that the Republicans argue in favor of nation building. It is ironic in that they use to go after Clinton all the time over this same subject.

[Biggest Fan]

Before someone decides that this thread is pointless and thus gets closed I wanted to say that I believe that dialogue on this subject is important and meaningful.

To Freaker By ... calling someone an 'idiot' is harsh. To say that you believe their ideas are 'idiotic' is not so offensive.

[timouse]

There is one thing that I really do not understand (and no I am not tyring to start an arguement or open up Pandora's Box)' date=' if your not an American or one of the allies in the war then why is it such a big deal. It is our young men and women who are dying and it is our tax dollars being spent. **If you think about it we make you guys look pretty good.[/quote']

Because when it comes to war on this kind of scale and intent, it engages us as members of the world community whether we are actively involved or not. Besides, some of us are simply appalled by war and cannot sit idly by with no concern or opinion. The actions of the US Administration against Iraq do not exist in a bubble, only of concern to those actively involved in it.

what marco said.

so biggest fan, did you like Wolf or Tiger better?

[Biggest Fan]

'If' we can I would like to try and focus on this one simple question. If it was up to you would you pull out the soldiers and end this 'war' right now.

**Not that I would not be happy to continue to discuss various issues related to this topic.

[Lazlo]

You should always pull out of soldiers and save it for a sailor.

[SmoothedShredder]

This comes from William Blackstones Commentary on the laws of England, 1765. One of the first prited uses of the word Idiot, which coincidently, supplies a definition so we don't have to beat around the bush.

Book One, Chapter 8: Of the King's Revenue:

Branch 18

I proceed therefore to the eighteenth and last branch of the king's ordinary revenue; which consists in the custody of idiots, from whence we shall be naturally led to consider also the custody of lunatics.

An idiot, or natural fool, is one that has had no understanding from his nativity; and therefore is by law presumed never likely to attain any. For which reason the custody of him and of his lands was formerly vested in the lord of the see; (and therefore still, by special custom, in some manors the lord shall have the ordering of idiot and lunatic copyholders) but, by reason of the manifold abuses of this power by subjects, it was at last provided by common consent, that it should be given to the king, as the general conservator of his people, in order to prevent the idiot from wasting his estate, and reducing himself and his heirs to poverty and distress: This fiscal prerogative of the king is declared in parliament by statute 17 Edw. II. c. 9. which directs (in affirmance of the common law) that the king shall have ward of the lands of natural fools, taking the profits without waste or destruction, and shall find them necessaries; and after the death of such idiots he shall render the estate to the heirs; in order to prevent such idiots from aligning their lands, and their heirs from being disherited.

So, keep an eye on your lands!!!

[MarcO]

yes, get your troops out of there.

[AdamH]

'If' we can I would like to try and focus on this one simple question. If it was up to you would you pull out the soldiers and end this 'war' right now.

**Not that I would not be happy to continue to discuss various issues related to this topic.

I don't enjoy any of your discussion topics. If you keep prefacing your responses with "I don't want to start a debate, but" I don't think anyone will take you seriously. Particularly when, as above, you're continuing to probe further into something you were supposedly not trying to instigate.

It's bad form, and generally I think it's belittling to people who, in other threads, carry on perfectly relevant or well-constructed irrelevant discussions.

Try and put some more thought into what you're saying.

[Davey Boy 2.0]

[Steve from Cleveland]

Actual Postcard from U.S. Soldier

Edited August 18, 2005 by Guest

[MarcO]

Steve - for some reason, I can't see your image. I can see other images on this site so I don't think it's just on my end. Just so ya know!

peace.

[Deeps]

yes, get your troops out of there.

What would this solve?

They've been bombed back into the stone age and the entire country is so amazingly unstable wouldn't the different fasctions within the country just go after eachother in civil war? Seems likely and also quite endless.

The whole situation is F'd but it is a fact of our global communities' lives.

What are alternatives to leaving and hoping it works out?

[MarcO]

The country is now extremely unstable as a result of US aggression. Get those troops out of there, their presence is offensive.

This is not supposed to be a humanitarian mission designed to curb civil wars. A strengthened UN is the appropriate mechanism to address those issues. It is supposed to the American mission to, um, rid the world of Iraq's WMDs. Sorry, I mean to bring democracy to Iraq and then leave. Um, something like that. Ok, they are there to maintain order and curtail looming civil wars. Next month, they may be there to keep a family's secret recipe for falafel from getting out. Whatever floats yer boat.

US troops never should have been there in the first place. Their whole reason for being there was clearly a sham. In the wake of that, their presence is illegitimate.

I say "get them out" but I know the US will maintain their disgusting presence in the region for years to come. Shame.

[Deeps]

I agree.

Their prescence and the aggression that years of expanding bizarre military culture and general redneckity has fostered remaining in Iraq is definitley keeping the gas can next to the furnace, but them leaving without the the UN Peacekeepers immediately arriving as the US military departs is a brutal idea.

I don't know if the UN would spear head a peace keeping effort in the wake of the U.S. completely disregarding the international procedures and ethics the UN was founded on. It would set a bad precedent.

The pompous bullshit that a portion of the US eats and breathes has really got to end.

World Leaders not so much....righteous tunnel visionaries...mais oui.

Can I get some freedom fries with my sequel to Viet Nam?

Edited August 18, 2005 by Guest

[timouse]

the US is building "enduring bases" in iraq. ironically, according to Naomi Klein, this is the only construction going on in iraq. fat chance of them leaving any time soon.

the editor of In These Times was on TUC Radio recently and talked about overlaying a map of current US incursion with a map of existing oil reserves...surprise! guess which superpower has all the worlds' oil surrounded?