bouche Posted July 18, 2003 Report Share Posted July 18, 2003 Solutions, ideas and news only please. There were alot of great ideas in the other thread, for example read some of Paisley's posts. So far, the charity/donations thing would be great...but is it beyond that now? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tungsten Gruvsten Posted July 18, 2003 Report Share Posted July 18, 2003 How about this: Announce the end of the festival, and declare that there would be free music at Frontier Town every long weekend. Instead of the usual $5 to camp there, on the long weekend it would cost $40 for the weekend or $20 for one night....and you get free music.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TonyRage Posted July 18, 2003 Report Share Posted July 18, 2003 I really don't think there is anything we can do. As many people have already pointed out, it is up to Rick here to take care of this. The only idea I can think of is a variation on Jared's idea to have a petition. Instead of one petition, let's maybe work out a form letter which we can print out individually and each send a copy, say once a week. Put a little pressure on them, let the county know that we really like it there. We are willing to sign the waiver and deal with our own shit, and just tell them it is our friend's place and he can invite as many people over as he wants. If they have a problem with sound, they can give Rick a ticket, for which we all must agree to chip in. The problem is in Tornoto sound tickets can be $10,000. How much would Durham charge? If you think this is a good idea, I can type up a sample letter. It's best to make modifications so it's more personal, but the general idea should be the same. Anyone know which department of the municipality we are dealing with. I have addresses for the following departments: Planning department, Works Department, Econ. developement and Tourism Department, and the HQ. My choice would be Tourism since we can appeal to the idea of more people spending money in Durham. What do you think? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tooly Posted July 18, 2003 Report Share Posted July 18, 2003 i like this donation idea as well.... maybe just a change of venue is what we need. but i love frontiers location right now, wouldnt really be the same in some new field... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paisley Posted July 18, 2003 Report Share Posted July 18, 2003 quote: Originally posted by Tungsten Gruvsten: How about this: Announce the end of the festival, and declare that there would be free music at Frontier Town every long weekend. Instead of the usual $5 to camp there, on the long weekend it would cost $40 for the weekend or $20 for one night....and you get free music.... thats pretty good law school seems to be paying off! the petition thing has to wait until Rick does whatever he's doing about it... its not our park no matter how much we like it... if he asks for that kind of help I'm sure we can gather up a lot of support... no one but Rick should be talking to Durham right now... he's managed to juggle it up until now, lets have some faith Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jon. Posted July 18, 2003 Report Share Posted July 18, 2003 If CTMF has reached a new level, then maybe it should be dealt with in a new manner. - find a venue that can handle high volumes - calculate the costs of licence, sound equipment, security, bands and factor that into the admission - w or w/o camping - a better run festival will certainly change the "grassroots" aspect of it- which is kind of a drag - but will give CTMF a higher profile. This could result in sposorship for sound equipment and higher profile acts, ie keller, new deal, skb, mmw.....there would still be an opportunity for the bands we love - canjam nero, gtb, dr. hux. wassabi, elec meat, ... - from the response t this festival it may be time to "grow" the concept. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarcO Posted July 18, 2003 Report Share Posted July 18, 2003 What about scrapping the "music festival" tag and calling it a "Family Reunion", with bands? Could that get us around the "entertainment" tax or whatever they want to hit us up with?? "Yeah, I'm MarcO. Meet my brother paisley, my cousin Sarahbelle, my great uncle Secondtube, my grandfather Esau13......" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paisley Posted July 18, 2003 Report Share Posted July 18, 2003 well I see the logic behind another venue but that would kind of be some other festival... with no saloon... Rick and Mark have been partners for quite a while and deserve a hand for what they've accomplished... I'd definately like to see at least on one more Labour day up at the ghost town... bringin in bigger bands does create opportunities but CTMF is growing into an opportunity of its own... in another park odds are you're going to end up with a different crowd, plus us... less of the, wander where you want, family feel unless the city is crazy dead set against Rick (and us) I'd say there is room for negotiation... if he proves everything is safe and offers some free promotion for the city I think he can probably get away pretty well... anyone I've talked to in the city seemed reasonable enough Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paisley Posted July 18, 2003 Report Share Posted July 18, 2003 sadly I was face down on a hill during Special Ed so I can't say much (a casualty of drinking too much too early) I went up to Durham thinking I could maybe climb a tree and walk in the forest and write some prose and stuff because I thought the line-up was weak... I got proven wrong Tala in the saloon were awesome which was something as i had just seen them the week before, all fresh and new... nice... and Isumah (later in the saloon) was a total golden suprise... hadn't heard of them before and they had me stuck in the saloon until the wee morning with fast fat funky grooves and quick changes... really great stuff there, definately check them out... there were two bands a night in the saloon due to rain showers and tala's bus breaking down on route... made for a nice change of pace, especially with the smaller, more intimate crowds best burt showing sunday night I've seen in some time... unstoppable like a freight train, made you feel special being there... something like a 4 or 5 hour set! mark wilson and the way starting up at 4:30 monday morning was the perfect finale... jonny on drums vocals and bass rocked hard... mark shining, finally done work... and the tired band unwilling to slack at all... jiggedy country fun there were only about 4 or 5 hundred people in the park which had a nice feel to it... very homey I really wasn't expecting much and came away having had one of my best times yet there I know everyone goes on about the party but musically I got an absolute bargain being there for $40... I'd say it was more a matter of the big event writers weren't there so mostly people talked about the party if you had've been there kung I think you would've enjoyed yourself... no sketch scenes until the late dawn and even then pretty subtle, tired smiles by the fire sort of stuff (until shawnald got everyone excited but I just found that funny and fitting for the wild frontier) ps. - didn't get to see diesel dog friday night either but the killer cuban sax player apperently sat in, as well as a bunch of others... when i got there saturday everyone couldn't say enough about it, I really felt I missed out (are you sure you weren't there kung? I thought I briefly bumped into you over by the cabins on my way to get a beer... trick of the light I guess) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jared Posted July 18, 2003 Report Share Posted July 18, 2003 count me in for whatever you do,, i personally love frontier town,, but think that after time we would alll come to love a new venue, it just a matter of time till it get resolved, and there is really little we can do as a comunity, except offer our suport and help. i personally think that it will be resolved by labourday day and we will have our party if anyone has any good ideas of any thing good happening the first weekend of auguse when the fest was going to be, then let me know cause i am suddenly free that weekend Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Musicface Posted July 18, 2003 Report Share Posted July 18, 2003 Hey all! I think we might be talking about two different things here - Frontier Town as a venue & the Come Together Music Festival as an event. I understand Mark Wilson's contention that he doesn't want to be responsible for the venue aspect 'cus it's Rick's place and that's his responsibility. As much as I adore Frontier Town as a venue, my personal interest as a musician and music fan (and while I totally appreciate kung's position, most of the people I know from my CTMF experiences ARE interested in the music) is to go to a good festival that has bands from "our scene", many of whom I'm also lucky enough to have be a friend as well as a fan of. From that perspective, I'd be all for moving CTMF from Frontier Town if that's what it takes to save it. Things like the Saloon that have been mentioned here as unique to Frontier Town could be recreated with some other sort of indoor venue, couldn't they? In the meantime, it's probably up to Rick to fix the problems with the city and perhaps the festival in some form or another can return there if that stuff gets sorted out. My two-cents, - M. Oh yeh, P.S. quote:Originally posted by paisley: ps. - didn't get to see diesel dog friday night either but the killer cuban sax player apperently sat in, as well as a bunch of others...Just for the record, the sax player that sat in with DD was John from the Erin Smith Band. There were a couple of wierd guys, apparently both named Jay, playing harmonica and congas... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jared Posted July 18, 2003 Report Share Posted July 18, 2003 i'm with you music ,, we all need to sit back and chill, look at the problum creatively,, cause when it comes down to it there is little we can do, i like the form letter idea and the petition can't hurt. but i say we all wait a week or too to let rick and mark figure out what they want to do, then offer our help. i personaly am planning on calling rick next week to offer my assistance, inform him about whats going on in here, and to find out if frontier town is still open for pop by campers if any one has any coments or sugestions let me know I am not sugesting that i have anything to do with this or that i think it will help, but i am going to try so i can sleep better at nite knowing i did something rather then just sit around and complaine about it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kurly Posted July 18, 2003 Report Share Posted July 18, 2003 To me it seems that the township is nailing Frontiertown on its attendance numbers (over 1000 qualifies it as amusement park or whatever). It would suck having to do it, but maybe limiting attendance is an option. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jared Posted July 18, 2003 Report Share Posted July 18, 2003 i'm all for that, maybe what was need was alittle weeining out some people of the crowd. i think that if they didn't let all the locals who are just coming to get drunk and not busted by there parents in, then the crowd would for sure be under 1000, those kids could go there any time to party, i din't know if that makes sence or is mean, but its kinda how i feel,, i mean if only the people who wanted to go for the music and the scene then this never would have heppened,, but don't get my wrong i like the locals,, htey were the one who bought 90 % of the stuff from me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Esau Posted July 19, 2003 Report Share Posted July 19, 2003 I will just quote myself from the other CTMF thread here. quote: Just like the spring shaker in NB, they couldnt sell tix,but they could accept set "donations" which got you on a master list,in turn got you a bracelet to get in etc etc,this got them around the whole by-law thing there and allowed for 700+ people to party on my buddies private property.It also was completely legal.With a percentage of the "donations" goin to the boys & girls club. Maybe Rick & Mark should be checkin into that stuff(if they havent already). Just my thoughts...... I also agree with Luke that the drug scene has become kinda far out there,not that I am against anything like that,but shit in 2000 may 24 the scene was a hell of lot different. But hey whatever floats your boat I guess. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Super Freak Posted July 19, 2003 Report Share Posted July 19, 2003 ...sterile, music critique parties....heh heh heh I hope they have vocabulary workshops at them, that would be far out!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bouche Posted July 19, 2003 Author Report Share Posted July 19, 2003 This is one of the very rare threads that is being highly moderated. Mainly because it is a VERY serious topic that we can all help with. Don't be offended if anything that was off-topic was deleted. Please just remember the first post, and you saw what happened to the original thread - utter mayhem. I've been chatting with one of the Ottawa/Toronto bluesfest organizers and he's willing to offer advice and tips. I really would like to get someone close to Mark Wilson to call or email me so I can forward him to my seriously experienced contact. One of the most interesting pieces of advice he passed on was the fact that if Mark decides to go charity, he can work with the HRDC and get unemployed people that are interested in music to take a Festival Management course for free, and then they could work/organize the festival and get paid by the HRDC. This costs the festival nothing, and it also trains future employees. That's just one of the great tidbits he's got, and I don't know if anyone's explored any of these avenues yet. Please, just remember to talk to people, research and get some ideas. Share them, and 'stay on target'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaggyBalls Posted July 19, 2003 Report Share Posted July 19, 2003 these sounds like great ideas. If it's a private residence a disturbing the peace/sound infraction would be to a residence not a business or event. people would just be playing music and partying. much like a big house party. have you ever heard of some guy at his place getting a 10,000 simolian ticket just because of a rowdy party?? i bet it'd be about 200 bucks at the most. also, if it's a letter from the township will it stand up in court?? doesn't it have to be from the police or the LAW rather than the guy that people hired to divvy up the tax dollars?? I think the labour day party should still go on even if this hasn't been settled if this seems to be the case. the petition should be used in tandem with the form letter. we should try to get letters of reference from other municipalities that have similar festivals(eg. killaloe perhaps?? the place where lose yer shoes, and even american festivals where the parties are WAY bigger) just a thought...that is if we want to keep frontiertown in durham. why not go to owen sound, peterborough/kawartha, near ottawa somewhere, western quebec, or up the bruce peninsula? as fun as frontiertown is it's not the best venue around. I sincerely wish there was a jamband fest happeneing on the OM site. that's pretty ideal to me...there's even a clean lake nearby to swim in. I'm thinking that somebody (not me) should get in touch with mark wilson and rick to see if those are avenues worth exploring or if there should be afight to stay in durham. i dont know why we all have such geographic loyalty to a place that resents our presence. this is a huge province if we choose to stay in it...the magic comes from us, not the location. keep that in mind. I hope we can keep frontiertown where it is but if it's too much hassle we should cut our losses and get it organized in time for next year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason Posted July 19, 2003 Report Share Posted July 19, 2003 Anyone know anything about the site where they hold WEMF, the World Electronic Music Festival? I havn't been but I know it draws a large crowd and they seem to get away with it every year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TonyRage Posted July 19, 2003 Report Share Posted July 19, 2003 We can lways talk with some of the other festial organziers around the province to see if teh sites tehy use are will ing to have other fests, but the point that has been amde by many people is that FT is where we want to have it. If it's another site, it's another festival. GOTV moves all over and each time it's different, you don't know what to expect. When you go to FT you know you have teh saloon, the conservation area etc. WE LIKE FT and want to have the festival there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paisley Posted July 19, 2003 Report Share Posted July 19, 2003 the reason I say hold back on the petition is we don't know why they're shut down right now... hard to argue when you don't know what you're arguing if the problem is noise and the fine would be $10,000 dollars an extra $10 per person would cover the fine... I have a feeling that the problem isn't a noise complaint though or they would've been shut down long ago... its the number of people who are showing up I don't know this for a fact but it seems to be the gist of what I've heard so far more than 1000 people = a special event = special licensing = $$$ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paisley Posted July 19, 2003 Report Share Posted July 19, 2003 World Electronic Music Festival Trudeau's Park, Tweed, Ontario, Canada Over the years many battles have been fought to bring you this event. We have always been there to fight for your right to party and this year is no different! With pressure from the overblown media hype surrounding the non-existent “SARS crisis” to dealing with hypocritical members of the establishment, we have been kept very busy in our efforts. To make this event the best it can be and to allow it to happen in a fully legal and permitted environment, we have made some changes that we feel will allow us to continue bringing you the quality show you have come to expect. You spoke and we listened! Based on the overwhelming demand to return to the beach, we have done just that. This year we have decided to move WEMF2003 to a new and improved lakeside venue featuring a beautiful sandy beach, proper zoned camp grounds to which you can drive and park your own vehicle, BYOB and have a campfire. There is a fully licensed restaurant, running water, showers, flush toilets and even an indoor pool. Not only are we offering this improved venue but we are doing it at a reduced price. We encourage everyone to join us as we once again make history! WEMF ‘Plan B’ will be held at Trudeau’s Park in Tweed, Ontario approx. 2hrs East of Toronto. The venue features many improvements over our previous location including: - On-site beach & forested campgrounds! - Camp beside your car as you can now drive to your campsite! - Those of age can bring and enjoy their own alcohol at their campsites! NO GLASS - Can's Only! - Massive indoor halls for late night beats! - Running water, showers & flush toilets! - On-site restaurant and licensed lounge! - Payphones and much much more! (ps - I'm with you tonyrage, I'm for Frontier) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaggyBalls Posted July 19, 2003 Report Share Posted July 19, 2003 Of course we like frontiertown. it rocks, all i was saying is that if there's too much hassle then there's no reason to try to keep it there. an extra 10 to 15 bucks a head would make a fine go away. i doubt it's that easy though. i'd have half a notion to say that all festival goers drive 72 km/h while in grey county so as to get absolutely no hassles from the police, not talk about any partying while in town, and bathe before going to the festival(try to use soap). What else would they have to gossip about and get their feathers ruffled over? taxes? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jared Posted July 19, 2003 Report Share Posted July 19, 2003 i understand your point bouche, but why did you close the old post? i thought i was cool that so many people had so much to say about that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaggyBalls Posted July 19, 2003 Report Share Posted July 19, 2003 thanks for moderating. i don't mind my stuff being erased, because it was kinda off topic but it came down to another avenue...that if things don't work out and it becomes too much work for mark and rick to keep on doing this then kung could pop up and not have to complain about how crappy things are and who knows...maybe he'd actually do it. I just think it's kinda silly that certain topics always spring up. I'd be willing to help organize the festival. As much as nobody really knows my work habits and drive, I think I could do a great job. I'm sure there are a few other people on here that could help make this thing bigger than evolve with the right amount of time and effort. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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