Lefsetz asks Whats your take on The Hold Steady?

[Northern Wish]

From the Lefsetz Letter:

2. Brian Koppelman wrote in to tell me that the Hold Steady are the best band in America right now. He told me to listen to "Sweet Part Of The City", that it explodes on the third listen.

I got it on the first listen.

But I also had to say the guy's vocal worked against the track. Oh come on, I'm not saying his words are bad, but...I am saying they're bad. The final line of this track is ""We were bored so we started a band". Now if that isn't far too inside, if that's not cliched, what is? Then again, it's the fifth full set, so I guess they can be self-referential, but...WHO HEARD THE PREVIOUS RECORDS?

And the reviews of this album are uniformly...disappointing. I know, I checked.

"We'd like to play for you, we'd like to play for you..." Even the Boss doesn't issue lyrics that hackneyed. And give the Boss credit, he's got a sense of humor. Come on, how many points do you give Bruce for insisting "Don't Stop Believin'" close Sting's Rainforest show? Bruce is one of us. Craig Finn of the Hold Steady is not.

And if you want to hear this same thing done better, check out the Iron City Houserockers' "Have A Good Time (But Get Out Alive)" The title track of that album is better than anything on the Hold Steady record, and it wasn't a hit either.

It's not that the Hold Steady are bad, they're not. I can enjoy them. Well, not all the tracks, but... The point is, in a world with so many diversions do I CHOOSE to listen to them? That's the challenge bands face. Can I not wait to hear your music? Is it driving me to my computer, to my iPod. If it's not...it's just part of the endless morass of ignored music.

"The Sweet Part Of The City": http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cmx8N6CC64Y

What's your take?

[c-towns]

Nail on head, the band is good but the spoken word lead is horrible.

[Schwa.]

I have a travelling scale for bands....ie: how far would i travel to see them and them only. It expands beyond that as well to: would I go the 100km to Toronto to see them on a weeknight.

the answer of 0km precludes the second question.

[Northern Wish]

Interesting so far, I figured Crowes fans would have dug it a bit more....

[c-towns]

Why? Chris Robinson actually sings.

[Freeker]

Lefsetz is in a foul mood today it seems, so don't take too much from his rant (though he makes many accurate points)

Did you see how pissed off he was at the guy who offered to send him the "real" version of Float by Broken Bells. He went apeshit, though he was being accussed of stealing lol

[Big Wooly Mammoth]

i really like THS's version of atlantic city on the war child album (in which the original artists chose who should cover them).

and I generally like their stuff. but i'm not yet convinced about them. music is great. "singing" not so sure about. looking forward to seeing them at blusefest.

by the way, that war child CD is awesome. some incredible covers of great songs.

[Northern Wish]

From a Unified Scenester to Mr Lefsetz. I tried to come up with something better- but this is in the class of Hallmark sentiment; its just better than my own.

Bob,

Not unlike your late arrival to Twitter (c'mon..admit you were late to that party) you're three years late to The Hold Steady.

"We were bored so we started a band" is a revisit of the opening track to the bands first record, "Almost Killed Me" where he sings "I got bored so I started a band, gonna start it with a Positive Jam, man"

ALL THE TIME you talk about how when a band grabs someone and moves them that they evangelize and shout it from the rooftops - The Hold Steady IS that band, Bob.

Those of us who've been adamant supporters of "the best bar band in America" have slews of friends who, not unlike you, are absolutely sick of hearing about how great this band is.

We buy the tee shirts. We go to the shows in an almost Deadhead-like frequency and spin the records for anyone who will listen.

Isn't that what you say is the way music is supposed to spread? Organically? The guys started with very little ambition to record a proper album, much less play out and now you're gonna rail them for their placement on the charts? (BTW- Billboard had HIW at #26 this week.)

Sold out shows in almost every city they play including the 9:30 Club in DC, First Ave in MN and in October play at the Beacon Theater in NYC-

As for the back-catalog- the next time one of your car-reviewer buddies takes you on one of your jaunts up the coast in one of those hundred-thousand-dollar speed machines, pop on "The Swish" from Almost killed Me and tell me you don't feel the need to hammer the gas pedal to the floor and get the hell out of town.

Awhile ago, you mentioned in one of your newsletters something along the lines of "I don't hate The Hold Steady, I hate their FANS"

To that, I must extend the finger in the middle of my hand to you, Bob, for that statement goes against almost everything you say is necessary from a band today. Interactivity, clever videos and a fucking RABID fanbase that will go to the ends of the earth for their favorite band.

You asked for it...and I'm sure you're getting it. I can almost bet that your inbox is getting hammered with a fairly equal number of "Hell yeah, I hate that band" and "Fuck you, Bob...The Hold Steady rules" emails.

It's sort of like the band Ween for me....I can't STAND them. Never got em. Maybe they're too far over my head. But there are legions of fans who swear they're the second coming of Christ.

"Eye of the beholder", right?

[AD]

Don't enjoy the majority of the band's work, but I did enjoy your letter Sean. Well done.

[NewRider]

These clever kids are killing me.

[Schwa.]

My life is a Hold Steady lyric.

[Freak By Night]

Count me amongst those who don't "get" The Hold Steady. But, I'm keeping an open mind - I'll take in their set at the Bluefest to see what all the fuss is about.

[ollie]

Lefsetz has a point, even if it's not well informed. I was big Hold Steady fan during their Boys & Girls In America phase but got completely burned out on their self-referential lyrics before Stay Positive was even officially released. They ride a pretty fine line between kitsch and cliché.

For that reason I've decided not to listen to any of the new tracks until I can go into HMV and buy the disc and slowly soak it all in. I'm hoping to fall in love with this band again because they used to give me such a rush.

[Northern Wish]

If it matters at all to you, the Stay Positive release was the worst of their 4 cds up to that point. I find HiW to be a very welcomed departure.... if only for the fact that side 2 of the album features NO guitar solos.

I'll give Lefsetz credit for nailing a couple of things:

1) "I don't hate The Hold Steady, I hate their fans." I think I have to be the #1 example of this, even I get sick of hearing me talk about THS....

2) This thread is a great example of how Craigs vocal style work against the bands popularity- although I find it mystifying as its the thing that drew me in.

But Bob is dead wrong on other points:

1) "And if you want to hear this same thing done better, check out the Iron City Houserockers' "Have A Good Time (But Get Out Alive)". No not really Bob, they suck- but thanks for the reminder of the shitty comparisons this band draws.

2) "We'd like to play for you. We'd like to pray for you." This is a far different lyric than he quotes (we'd like to play for you x2). The addition of "pray for you" is the essence of The Hold Steady using religious imagery to convey deep feelings.

3) "Even The Boss doesn't issue lyrics that hackneyed." Unsubscribe right there. The Boss' lyrics are hackneyed- WHAT?! The guy that wrote Johnny 99, Ghost of Tom Joad, Reason to Believe and Mary Queen of Arkansas is hackneyed? Oy vey!

4) "The reviews are universally disappointing." Metacritic (a web review almagamator) scores the album a 77, noting "generally favorable reviews" from the 26 sources that they used for this rating. Ent Weekly, Absolute Punk, The Guardian UK, NME, Boston Globe, Paste, Rolling Stone, All Music Guide- all rate the album at an 80 out of 100 or better......

[c-towns]

I stand by my hockey pool team name.

[Northern Wish]

Then you'll stand in the basement!

[c-towns]

So you agree with me that they suck, problem solved.

[NewRider]

I stand by my hockey pool team name.

Is it "I swallow loads for guitar noodling"? If so, I stand by it as well.

[Northern Wish]

Alright before this thread dies, as that seems to be the end of the daily participants- I have a few things to add:

1) I don't think THS are for everyone. Their style of music has a limited appeal. Even for me; I don't listen to this all of the time. I may go through spurts with new albums, tours or shows- but overall I listen to them when I'm boozing a little, driving alot or boozing alot. They are fun as hell for me, and I wish others felt that same joy. Like Craig says at the end of some shows before Killer Parties (killer parties almost killed me)- "There is so much joy in what we do up here. We just want to thank you for sharing in that joy with us." If anyone felt 1/10 as good as I do listening to their tunes at just the right moment- you'd get it.

2) Craigs vocal style should not be lumped in with his content. If you don't like how he is saying it, at least listen to what he is saying. Too many people over the ages have missed amazing songs by Joy Division, Neil Young, Rush etc. because they didn't like the style of singing. He is one of the best lyricists in America today. He should not be confused with cliched- his story over 5 albums can be traced chronlogically. Almost Zappa esque in his conceptual continuity. But using simple language and concepts at the same time.

3) I don't expect or even want this band to grow beyond what they are. I figure two more albums and they pack it in and take full time day jobs. I don't want to see them in arenas, I don't think they even want to play arenas- I don't think it could translate beyond the fuzzy fizzy smoky pit of a club. They might, they might not- but they will have kicked my ass and saved my soul on more than a few thousand occasions.....

[Kanada Kev]

^^^^

great post

[c-towns]

I find his lyrics as lame as his spoken word technique but apparently my taste in music is lowbrow.

[Big Wooly Mammoth]

they are on the late late show with craig ferguson tonight.

[dave-O]

The guy can't sing a lick, but Craig Finn is one of the best vocalists going. He sounds like he's saving rock n'roll with every line.

I'm with Ollie, I'm not big on the latest two albums. But first nice day, I guarantee you I'm cranking Boys & Girls in America with the windows down.

[zero]

They might, they might not- but they will have kicked my ass and saved my soul on more than a few thousand occasions.....

"projectionists and publicists, athletes and comedians

photographers and columnists, subscribers and enthusiasts

participants and spectators, the ragers and the clever kids

we're all actors and actresses

i want to thank you all for having me

a special thanks to the academy

for birthing me and blessing me

with this fantastic opportunity

to let the light shine down on me

now let us grieve for dead celebrities

we know them all from all the magazines"

Spectres from B-Sides

[Northern Wish]

To really give you an idea of how those simple lyrics go way deeper than you ever thought- this guy from THS message board tried to identify all of the references in We Can Get Together (then the thread sprawled into 5 pages with many more additions corrections etc).

We Can Get Together References:

- She played "Heaven isn't Happening" <--- A ref to 80's punk band The Ass Ponys

- She played "Heaven is a Truck" <--- A Pavement song

- She said Heavenly was cool, I think they were from Oxford <--- Heavenly was a poppy band in the 90s from Oxford. Also, something something twee.

- I only had one single, it was a song about a pure and simple love <--- Heavenly's 7" single, "Our Love is Heavenly"

- There's a girl on Heaven Hill, <--- Husker Du song "Girl Who Lives On Heaven Hill"

- I come up to her cabin still, <--- paraphrased lyrics from ^

- She said Husker Du got huge <---duh

- They started in St. Paul <--- They did.

- Do you remember "Makes no Sense at All"? <--- A Husker Du song. ***

- And Heaven is the whole of the heart <--- Lyrics from the Psychedelic Furs song "Heaven". They sang "Pretty in Pink"

- And paradise is by the dashboard light <-- Meat Loaf; Paradise By The Dashboard Light. Certain Songs, you know?

- Utopia's a band, they sang "Love Is The Answer," <--- prog rock band in the 70s and 80s. And they probably are right.

He wasn't just the drummer, he was the singer's little brother <--- In Heavenly, the drummer, Mathew Fletcher, was the brother of the singer Amelia