Reminder: The Beatles remain the best band ever.

[Jaimoe]

Oh yeah, The Beatles exceeded the hype, but imploded partly because of it.

[hamilton]

Potential, yes, unrealized potential, even more so.

I'm still not sure what you mean by this. I honestly think that the Beatles couldn't realistically have carried on for much longer than they did.

[Jaimoe]

And Rat, it's completely negligent of you to call The Beatles "Greatness a product of revisionistic history". The greatest artists of popular music are considered great for many reasons, one big one being their music transcends and continues to influence through generations. Elvis, The Beatles, Hendrix, The Who, The Kinks, The Stones, Miles Davis, James Brown, Frank Sinatra, Muddy Waters etc... all live up and exceed the hype and DO NOT suffer from the misused revisionist tag.

You gotta research and learn about the different eras before you make narrow-minded statements.

[hamilton]

I don't think the Beatles felt like they could live up to the hype any more.

It was more like John thought he was a superstar, Paul was a complete control freak, and George couldn't get his compositions on the albums because John and Paul would give him any room. The all hated each other long before Let It Be was recorded.

[jayr]

For the sake of argument (I'm sober and slightly more rational now) what if you were to replace the words "The Beatles" with the word "Elvis" in this thread?

Did Elvis even write a song??

Honestly does anyone know if he did? For some reason I don't think so.

Edited May 9, 2007 by Guest

[Rob Not Bob]

For the sake of argument (I'm sober and slightly more rational now) what if you were to replace the words "The Beatles" with the word "Elvis" in this thread?

Did Elvis even write a song??

Honestly does anyone know if he did? For some reason I don't think so.

He did end up with a few writing credits, but I think those were from publishing negotiations and I don't think he actually did any "writing" of the songs.

I don't really care for the "He didn't write anything" slam on Elvis anyway. The idea of a musician having to write all of his own material to have any credibility is a relatively new phenomenon (late 60s, at any rate) and before that it was pretty much given that songwriting and performance were separate. There were some artists in the 50s who wrote most of their own material ( Check Berry, Buddy Holly), but they were very much the exception to the rule. I don't know if, for instance, Frank Sinatra, Billie Holliday or Aretha Franklin ever wrote a note of their own music but are still considered great artists. Why should Elvis be considered any different? Is the art of the vocalist or the interpreter that disregarded?

Rant over ...

[MarcO]

I still believe the Beatles Greatness is largley a product of revisionist history.

You can believe that but I'd love to hear the rationale behind it. As far as I know, the songwriting tandem of Lennon/McCartney attracted attention almost immediately. Music critics were quick to hear elements of sophistication and originality in even some their earliest pop hits.

Sure, they seem familiar as pie to us all now, but in 1963 a song like "I Want To Hold Your Hand" jumped off the airwaves because it was just heads and shoulders above the polo-sweater crooning that pervaded the airwaves. Remember, in the early 1960's, rock music was considered past. Elvis had joined the army and Doris Day was the flavour of the, um, day. And apart from being a refreshing wind of change from the blandness of the times (which they were), it was also apparent to many that these guys were instinctively onto something truly great.

The fact that they also demonstrate the potential to participate in an awesome shift in popular culture is just cherry on the melodic cake

Potential' date=' yes, unrealized potential, even more so.[/quote']

Apart from laser beams shooting from their eyes, I'm unclear what the Beatles' unrealized potential would be. Picking up where I left off in 1963, by the next year they were starting to get cerebral ("I Feel Fine", "Baby's In Black"), by 1965 they had released "Rubber Soul" - which a good argument could be made as being the ultimate pop music album, each and every song is a jewel. And stop for a second there - in their day, nobody wrote their own songs. Previously, it was Brill Building, Tin Pan Alley production line writing. The only fair comparison to what they were acheiving at that time was Bob Dylan, and that's quite some company to keep! Nevermind the acid tinged sensibility of 1966's "Revolver", blowing millions of minds and one step ahead of the counterculture that would spawn the likes of.... the Grateful Dead!

Their artistic achievements in the midst of a music related mania the global world had never previously seen strikes me as potential completely fulfilled, and then some.

I'm all for disagreement about that but that's my take and I'm sticking to it. There's no revisionism going on. People KNEW the Beatles were special in 1963 and they knew it 1966 and the knew it in 1969, music punters, fellow musicians and critics alike. I can't even imagine what it would be like to experience that music being introduced to the world in real time.

[AD]

Good post MarcO, I think you've summed it up quite nicely.

[jayr]

For the sake of argument (I'm sober and slightly more rational now) what if you were to replace the words "The Beatles" with the word "Elvis" in this thread?

Did Elvis even write a song??

Honestly does anyone know if he did? For some reason I don't think so.

He did end up with a few writing credits' date=' but I think those were from publishing negotiations and I don't think he actually did any "writing" of the songs.

I don't really care for the "He didn't write anything" slam on Elvis anyway. The idea of a musician having to write all of his own material to have any credibility is a relatively new phenomenon (late 60s, at any rate) and before that it was pretty much given that songwriting and performance were separate.

[/quote']

Yeah I agree. It doesn't change the effect Elvis had thats for sure. To my knowledge it wasn't actually until The Beatles that artists had more than 1 or 2 originals on each album, if that.

[Dr. J]

I can't even imagine what it would be like to experience that music being introduced to the world in real time.

I suppose I'm one of the few folks around here old enough to have actually been around when The Beatles hit...and Marco has summed it up quite nicely. What The Beatles were doing musically and otherwise was absolutely mind blowing. No question that they raised popular music to a level it had never been before and were at the forefront of a cultural revolution that was historical in its impact.

Having said that, we must remember that The Beatles were not operating in a total wasteland. Musically, in many ways, it was the genius of Buddy Holly that in the beginning set the stage for the Beatles and the whole British invasion thing. That fact is too often overlooked.

[bouche]

Did someone drop boiler rat on it's head?

In a way, I'm glad there's someone provoking all of these posts. This is a good extension to the thread. I recently finished reading this book (thanks Tungstengruvsten!) and I recommend it to anyone looking for beatles music history. It's a great read and for a guy that thinks he knows alot about the beatles, I learned alot in this book.

[Kanada Kev]

Very cool book bouche. I remember picking that one up in a store and getting glued to it for a couple of hours! Absolutely unbelievable at what they accomplished during those 8 years! Only 8 years people!! That's nothin'.

For another really cool Beatles read (and it's free) check this out:

http://www.revolverbook.co.uk/

A free e-book telling the story of the Beatles 1966 album Revolver.

[Esau.]

I always find it funny when someone says things like "greatness is realtive and subjectional." but then tells you the band/music you love isn't as good as another...

Your a great guy BR, but that made me scratch my head is all.

[boiler]

Did someone drop boiler rat on it's head?

In a way, I'm glad there's someone provoking all of these posts.

cha ching, everybody knows the Beatles are the greatest duh! Lennon was right when he said they were more popular than Jesus. It's like a rule when drinking "don't talk about politics, religion or the beatles." Evderybody has an opinion.

Anyway, if a band, musician or a shy country hick's songs are still as loved today as they were then, than obviously there is a greatness to the band and no doubt the beatles are about as great as you can get for the amount of time they put into it. I just don't think they were done and in my mind their reputation suffers for it.

The lessons Elvis teach me is that music is unlimited and songcraft is the key to immortality.

Just beacuse he didn't write music doesn't mean the above comment isn't true if you think about it. Besides, there's other tickets to immortality.

Anyways, I could really give a shit about Elvis.

...coincindently I did bang my head a couple times today, mucking around the boiler, but that was after my posts. Perhaps foreshadow?

[boiler]

I always find it funny when someone says things like "greatness is realtive and subjectional." but then tells you the band/music you love isn't as good as another...

Your a great guy BR, but that made me scratch my head is all.

well took

[MarcO]

respect.

[Kanada Kev]

Happy 40th Anniversary Sgt. Peps!

Edited June 1, 2007 by Guest

[Davey Boy 2.0]

McCartney quiz

[Dr_Evil_Mouse]

Check this out - The Beatles Verdict

Judge cites 42 Beatles songs to teach beer thief a lesson

Last updated at 15:47pm on 4th June 2007

A judge sentencing a Beatles-loving beer thief quoted 42 of the band’s song titles in his verdict.

Andrew McCormack, 20, was asked to recommend to a US court what his sentence should be for stealing beer.

He wrote: “Like the Beetles say, Let It Beâ€. But his cheeky quip did not impress Gregory Todd, a 56-year-old district court judge in Montana.

In a sentencing memorandum Judge Todd first corrected McCormack's misspelling and then gave the defendant a lesson in The Beatles discography.

He replied: “Mr McCormack, you pled guilty to the charge of Burglary. To aid me in sentencing I review the pre-sentence investigation report.

“I read with interest the section containing Defendant’s statement. To the question of ‘Give your recommendation as to what you think the Court should do in this case’, you said, ‘Like the Beetles say Let It Be'.

“While I will not explore the epistemological or ontological overtones of your response, or even the syntactic of symbolic keys of your allusion, I will say Hey Jude, Do You Want to Know a Secret?

"The greatest band in rock history spelled their name B-e-a-t-l-e-s.

"I interpret the meaning of your response to suggest that there should be no consequences for your actions and I should Let it Be so you can live in Strawberry Fields Forever.

"Such reasoning is Here, There and Everywhere. It does not require a Magical Mystery Tour of interpretation to know The Word means leave it alone.

"I trust we can all Come Together on that meaning.

"If I were to overlook your actions and Let It Be, I would ignore that Day in the Life on April 21, 2006.

“Evidently, earlier that night you said to yourself I Feel Fine while drinking beer.

“Later, whether you wanted Money or were just trying to Act Naturally you became the Fool on the Hill on North 27th Street.

"As Mr Moonlight at 1.30am, you did not Think for Yourself but just focused on I, Me, Mine.

"Because you didn't ask for Help, Wait for Something else or listen to your conscience saying Honey Don't, the victim later that day was Fixing a Hole in the glass door you broke."

Judge Todd went on: "After you stole the 18 pack of Old Milwaukee you decided it was time to Run For Your Life and Carry That Weight.

“But when the witness said Baby it's You, the police responded I'll Get You and you had to admit that You Really Got a Hold on Me.

"You were not able to Get Back home because of the Chains they put on you.

“Although you hoped the police would say I Don't Want to Spoil the Party and We Can Work it Out, you were in Misery when they said you were a Bad Boy.

"When the police took you to jail, you experienced Something New as they said Hello Goodbye and you became a Nowhere Man.

"Later when you thought about what you did you may have said I'll Cry Instead. Now you’re saying Let it Be instead of I'm a Loser.

“As a result of your Hard Day's Night you are looking at a Ticket to Ride that Long and Winding Road to Deer Lodge.

"Hopefully you can say both now and When I'm 64 that I Should Have Known Better."

In McCormack’s sentencing he received probation, a community service order and a fine.

[TheGoodRev]

That's hilarious, DEM, I missed that post when you first posted.

Hey Facebookers, you can now join the Facebook group inspired by this thread: http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=2410123951

[Jaimoe]

The Beatles win an award and look who accepts it for them. Funny stuff indeed:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SLAItPi3ef0&mode=related&search=

[TheGoodRev]

I wonder how Brian took it.

[Jaimoe]

I wonder how Brian took it.

Imagine if Al Jardine accepted on behalf of The Beatles.

[paisley]

(removed by request)

a Beatles thread is no place for poor taste

Edited July 8, 2007 by Guest
drop now!

[AdamH]

Still the best band ever?