The next person with a lawnchair...

[Rob Not Bob]

And another thing. Two girls working at the beer tent told me not to tip because the money doesn't go to the volunteers but to the organizers. And they were pretty pissed about it. Can anyone confirm either way?

According to Fiona, this is illegal ... tips are considered income and employers have no right to it.

[bradm]

And another thing. Two girls working at the beer tent told me not to tip because the money doesn't go to the volunteers but to the organizers. And they were pretty pissed about it. Can anyone confirm either way?

According to Fiona' date=' this is illegal ... tips are considered income and employers have no right to it.

[/quote']

If they're volunteers (as opposed to paid employees), are there restrictions on giving them money? If the festival has its charter/permit based on some jobs held by paid employees, and others by not-paid volunteers, if the volunteers receive any money at all, it might violate some regulation.

Aloha,

Brad

[AD]

i bet Dr. John would sign it. Although he'll never come back to Ottawa, and the chairs are the reason.

There was already one letter to the editor in the Citizen today; the writer suggested either cutting back on sales and allowing chairs, or banning them altogether.

Banning them is not going to work - that would kill Bluesfest.

i have a couple suggestions, which might be reasonable or not, they're just top of the head

1. If you're going to take a premium of space, pay a premium on your ticket. Each chair that comes in has to have a bracelet on it or something showing that the person has paid extra to take up the space of 3 people. Might get people thinking if they really need the chair or not.

2. Have fenced or roped off areas that are lawnchair only, like the Bluesfest guy said. Likewise have Standing-only area at the front.

3. No matter what, keep the walkways clear. If things don't change from the past two nights, if there is an emergency it will be chaos.

Heather, I have no idea how to get the points across to people. I'm pretty quiet and passive usually but this just irritates me to no end.

[CatPhish]

blood.boiling.

[MamaPink]

ok we bitch about this every year (and with good reason). what can we do that might actually have an effect? picket? protest? get onstage and freak out? burn and loot? seriously.

Let's make some signs, PROTEST! There are SO many of us. We'll have to think of catchy phrases to put on them, "If you stand up - fold 'em up!" or "You chair people suck a lot!"

Or we could make T-Shirts. A little more subtle, but if there are a lot of people wearing them, I think it would feel really good! I have those Iron-ons, we can make our own... and fast!

[Blane]

another year, another lawnchair thread.

Ahhh, Bluesfest.

Didn't anyone bother making the shirts?

Dude in lawnchair READING PAPER in the from row of fuckin' Calexico at Bluesfest:

Time for the "OFF" festival to take shape.

Edited July 6, 2007 by Guest

[phorbesie]

i'm glad someone's letter got printed already. maybe we should compose a group letter to the citizen with all the good points? too bad we couldn't get someone onto a news show in a 'debate' with a lawn chair person. well, maybe we could! i'd get all flustered though!

all those ideas of yours are good. i also am quiet and irritated! i hate how year after year we let these people win.

another idea from last year was printing up some sort of flyer. maybe a 'concert etiquette and lawn chair facts sheet' wouldn't be a bad idea, if we distributed thousands of them. i'd be willing to take on the carbon karma (from all the litter) for that one.

[bradm]

I suggest getting the city council involved, especially when the festival tries to get its approval for next year's festival. There has to be some Ottawa (or Ontario) regulation about maintaining access for emergency personnel, and if it can be documented that the festival isn't doing that (pictures, testimony, etc.), we might be able to have the city force the festival to come up with a plan to keep the pathways clear; that plan should include standards (e.g., a requirement that by-law officers be present for random inspections and monitoring) for ensuring the festival is living up to its responsibilities, and penalties/consequences (up to and including shutting the whole thing down) if they aren't.

Does anybody have any "ins" with the press? A little investigative story on how access for emergency personnel is being limited might be a good "scoop."

Aloha,

Brad

[ollie]

3. No matter what, keep the walkways clear. If things don't change from the past two nights, if there is an emergency it will be chaos.

Anyone wanna give the fire marshall's office a call? I'd hope they would take the compaint seriously.

[phorbesie]

good idea as well.

in the meantime, as in today...i will be happy to print a few thousand flyers up. so...

Lawn Chairs and Concerts

1. Lawn chairs and their immature owners force standers into pathways that should remain clear for emergency personnel and ease of movement for all festival goers.

2. A lawn chair takes up the space of 3? 4? people. When its occupant stands for a time and does not fold down the chair, add 1.

3. A festival is meant for enjoyment of music and dancing. Reading the newspaper from your lawnchair can be done at home.

4. When you purchase a ticket at the NAC or Scotiabank Place, etc., you have a specific seat and sight line that you have paid for. A festival does not work that way. You do not "own" a large portion of the site.

5. Please add more!! I have to go get a bunch of stuff copied for work today at UPS so I can add this to my order

[bradm]

3. No matter what' date=' keep the walkways clear. If things don't change from the past two nights, if there is an emergency it will be chaos.[/quote']

Anyone wanna give the fire marshall's office a call? I'd hope they would take the compaint seriously.

The thing I can't figure out is why the emergency personnel who are there and are getting blocked aren't complaining to their higher-ups.

Aloha,

Brad

[MamaPink]

Those are good, Phorbsie - but I would take "immature" out of the first sentence. We don't want to make them angry, just aware.

[Davey Boy 2.0]

this situation is ripe for a riot, 2 factions, years of grudges building up, plenty of discussion back and forth over the years

the lines are drawn and are very clear.

i'm bringing a hockey stick tonight

[phorbesie]

ok how about this then:

1. Lawn chairs and their owners force standers into pathways that should remain clear for emergency personnel and ease of movement for all festival goers. Throwing things and berating people that walk past your chair is not an appropriate reaction.

[AD]

going to city council will get nothing done. they are a bunch of douchebags.

i bet if you email or corral Lynn Saxberg or someone like that while at the festival she'd listen and perhaps make mention in a column.

the safety thing is a valid concern for everyone, but the lawnchair issue came up long before the site was unsafe and it might be cheating a bit to use that as the reason for crying foul this year. that can be a separate thing or a connected thing, but still, people should pack up chairs while standing, or should have a designated spot to use chairs so everyone is happy. safety wins, sitters win, and standers win.

[Im going home Donny]

Sounds like its time for a spray gun filled with some good ol' LSD....

[AD]

The thing I can't figure out is why the emergency personnel who are there and are getting blocked aren't complaining to their higher-ups.

Oh, dollars to donuts they are Brad. Of course they are!

[phorbesie]

Sounds like its time for a spray gun filled with some good ol' LSD....

bwaaaaaaaa :grin:

[Im going home Donny]

Sounds like its time for a spray gun filled with some good ol' LSD....

bwaaaaaaaa :grin:

thought ya might like that

[MamaPink]

Perfect, Phorbsie! I'll help hand them out. **just for the record, I agree they are immature**

I'm going to make a shirt for Gator to wear... he's especially good at telling people to fuck right off.

[Alexis]

the idea of paying a premium for lawn chair seats in the lawn chair section, or paying a fee upon arrival for bringing your lawn chair onto the concert grounds is a great idea.

Sadly, the way the universe works when bluesfest is on, it'll probably come back to bite standers in the ass. Organizers will probably hear the idea, and think "well, standers want their own space, standers want to be up front, standers want to hear and dance, well THEY can pay a premium for the better viewing points" it's easier to wristband a person than a chair i'd think, in their eyes anyways.

[bradm]

The thing I can't figure out is why the emergency personnel who are there and are getting blocked aren't complaining to their higher-ups.

Oh' date=' dollars to donuts they are Brad. Of course they are!

[/quote']

OK, but why, then, would the public complaining to the fire marshall (as ollie suggested) make a big difference? The fire marshall (I assume) has the authority to shut down the festival (or make the organizers re-organize things) if it's unsafe; if he knows it's unsafe (which is reasonable to assume, if his people are telling him what's going on, and not going on, on the ground), and hasn't done anything yet, will complaints from the public make him take action?

Aloha,

Brad

[AD]

1. Lawn chairs and their owners force standers into pathways that should remain clear for emergency personnel and ease of movement for all festival goers. Throwing things and berating people that walk past your chair is not an appropriate reaction.

We gotta make these as cordial and non-confrontational as possible. Make it a cooperative effort so that it seems like everyone is helping and making things better. People will buy into that a lot faster than being dictated to. (I don't think you are dictating, i'm just sayin') What about adding something about respecting fellow music lovers, or 'when you yell and don't cooperate with those around you, you ruin the concert for everyone.'

2. A lawn chair takes up the space of 3? 4? people. When its occupant stands for a time and does not fold down the chair, add 1.

I think a sitter takes up 2 people's spots, and a 'standing sitter' takes up 3 people's spots. More though if there are bags / coolers etc at their feet.

3. A festival is meant for enjoyment of music and dancing. Reading the newspaper from your lawnchair can be done at home.

This one - I'd take out the dancing bit. Maybe 'A festival is meant for the enjoyment of music with other music lovers.' Reading newspapers / books / talking on cellphones constantly, chatting with friends does not show love for the music, and should be done where you are not interfering with anyone else's experience.

4. When you purchase a ticket at the NAC or Scotiabank Place, etc., you have a specific seat and sight line that you have paid for. A festival does not work that way. You do not "own" a large portion of the site.

'A festival setting is not the same as a seated theatre - specific seats and therefore sight-lines are not reserved. People are allowed to stand to enjoy the concert wherever they please, just as the current rules allow for sitters to sit wherever they please.'

I dunno. I'm verbose and perhaps a bit too polite? There's gotta be something emphatic, like a watermark of a middle finger or something, hehe. Use that graphic that Blane posted.

[AD]

OK, but why, then, would the public complaining to the fire marshall (as ollie suggested) make a big difference? The fire marshall (I assume) has the authority to shut down the festival (or make the organizers re-organize things) if it's unsafe; if he knows it's unsafe (which is reasonable to assume, if his people are telling him what's going on, and not going on, on the ground), and hasn't done anything yet, will complaints from the public make him take action?

Perhaps nothing has happened because Dylan went on stage barely 12 hours ago?

I don't think the organisers are stupid, they HAD to know there were problems last night, but it's not something they can immediately fix, especially with 25 thousand people in the way. It'll take at least a day.

[phorbesie]

no, thanks for the suggestions! i made some of those changes.

how's this?

Catchy title anyone?

1. Lawn chairs and their owners force standers into pathways that should remain clear for emergency personnel and ease of movement for all festival goers.

2. A lawn chair takes up the space of 2 or 3 standing people. If its occupant stands for a time and does not fold down the chair, add 1.

3. A festival is meant for enjoyment of music with other music lovers. It’s important to respect all other festival patrons. This means sharing space, and also respecting the artists by not reading a book or having long cell phone conversations during the performance, unless you do so in a place which does not interfere with others’ enjoyment.

4. A festival setting is not the same as a seated theatre - specific seats and therefore sight-lines are not reserved. People are allowed to stand to enjoy the concert wherever they please, just as the current rules allow for sitters to sit wherever they please. A person can not "own" a large portion of the site.

5. Performers will play better if the audience is engaged. There is give and take involved.

6. A blanket can be held and easily folded up and carried, then used if a person is tired and wishes to sit for a time. A lawn chair can serve this purpose as well, if the owner understands that sitting means their view will of course be limited.

Thank you for reading! I hope people will consider the implications of their lawn chairs and the effect they have on other people.