Fate of Can Jam?

[guigsy]

it's sweeping the nation, brotha!

[Kelly-Anne]

Here in Thurso we had a thriving scene until the "man" shut us down. For the our scene to come back we need to take the "man" down with force. Currently we have several hundred kids training in the woods, working with liquids in an effort to create a super army of fans willing to pay top dollar for shows and product.

If we could duplicate this in every town village and suburb accross this great musical tundra, we would succeed in changing things for the better.

We will prevail and the scene will succeed. Working together and not against each other is the only way to go. I personally will work with anyone, even if they're not like me, if it means that the man pays for shutting us down.

By shutting us down in Thurso, the man (Guy Lamport-Brazeau- owner of Chez Louie) unwittingly planted the seeds for a great cultural change in the Outaoauis.

Forget the hate, show the love. We're not black, white or Indian, we're not jews or arabs or god's people, we all one for this great drive that will get jamband music back into Chez Louie's and in time greater exposure in cultural back waters like Burlington Ontario.

Dream. And dreams will dream with you my little fucked up dreamer.

[zero]

That's it my friend's - the rally cry - the clarion call!

get jamband music back into Chez Louie's

[Jay Funk Dawg]

so are we just going to sit back and let the scene peter out ? or are we going to do something about it ??

[afro poppa]

lets do something about it

I think that getting our own land idea (while prolly diffucult) would be a good step!!

[bouche]

[bradm]

so are we just going to sit back and let the scene peter out ? or are we going to do something about it ??

I

• roll-call (and provide info for) a lot of shows
  
• go to a lot of shows (about 50 so far this year as of this week)
  
• record a lot of shows
  
• upload and otherwise share what shows I can
  
• buy CDs from bands whose music I like
  
• spend a good amount of money at venues
  
• play in a band
  

Is there anything else you'd like me to do?

Aloha,

Brad

[Jay Funk Dawg]

Is there anything else you'd like me to do?

what we should be thinking is what can we do as a collective, not what can we do as an individual... I'm in a similar boat to your Brad, I take part at many levels of the 'scene' and I think that there is a opportunity for us to do something as a community...

[zero]

Look this is what I've been saying but the hippy/stoner amotivational syndrome seriously gets in the way. I'm not trying to be mean spirited I really think that's one of the big hold ups- motivation, consistency, discipline and yes I think drugs/alcohol affect that. I'm just as guilty if not moreso than anyone else although I also get my writing done.

Look at the article this month in Exclaim! on Torontopia for chrissake. These are (largely) shit bands who have weeny music crit friends who want to get into their bespectacled panties (well the panties don't have spectacles) BUT who play tonnes of gigs, get on community radio, often produce and package their own (often beautiful) DIY work. Seriously Blocks Recording Club is what we want to model ourselves after. We need an actual capitalized co-operative with or without share capital (or non-profit with share capital which is possible). I'm pretty sure Dependent music is a co-op too (Wintersleep, Holy Fuck, Jill Barber etc.).

Both the Toronto (Broken Social Scene, Hidden Cameras, Blocks etc.) or Montreal collective's like Constellation Records camp (Do Make Say Think, Godspeed You Black Emperor!, Silver Mt. Zion) and Arcade Fire et al. (Bell Orchestre, Torngat) seem to have a particularly high commitment to making ART. Jamming is by definition not ART. It is a sketch, it is often used as a rehearsal tool, it is considered to be a basic skill that all practicing musicians can do with some finesse or other. That's a whole other point.

Now here's a really fascinating piece about collectives though. I've been researching collective's like Steve Coleman's M-Base collective, Chicago Association for the Advancement of Creative Musicians (AACM), Sun Ra and his Arkestras, the Art Ensemble of Chicago and here's what african americans have been saying about the need for their own modes of production for years. Pianist Randy Weston had this to say in '68:

Do you think musicians should produce their own concerts and records?

I believe the musician of today and of the future has to own everything. He should own his own nightclub, even if it's no bigger than a small room. He should either have his own record company or be able to record his own material and lease it to record companies.... Considering our experience and how artists are exploited, particularly black artists, we must forget about working for other people and start working for ourselves.

Scholars like trombonist George Lewis believe that the activity of group improvisation, where musical identities interact in musical space, is a metaphor for individuals coexisting and cooperating in society, while maintaining their individual identities. Lewis believes that this metaphor indicates the coded presence of African sensibilities:

In improvised music, the development of the improvisor is regarded as encompassing not only the formation of individual musical personality, but the harmonization of one's musical personality with social environments, both actual and possible. This emphasis on personal narrative is a clear sign of the strong influence of the Afrological on improvised music.

What really interests me since frankly we are talking about Electric White Boy Blues is how the example of African Americans like the AACM or new judaic collectives like Black Ox Orkestar and Flying Bulgar Klezmer Band can influence us. I haven't quite confirmed these notions for myself but this remark also of Lewis' is illustrative:

When a tradition is missing or destroyed, ... (as in the case of the descendants of the African slaves in the Americas), part of the task of the descendants of that tradition is the redefinition of self entering the historical process through review, deconstruction and reconstruction.

[bradm]

Jamming is by definition not ART.

Please provide a definition of ART that, when followed, will allow me to create it, and which includes composed music, but not jamming. (At rehearsal yesterday, we got into a discussion about whether John Cage's piece "4:33" was music or not; I claimed it was [based on the "music is organized sound" definition], our drummer claimed it wasn't.)

Scholars like trombonist George Lewis believe that the activity of group improvisation, where musical identities interact in musical space, is a metaphor for individuals coexisting and cooperating in society, while maintaining their individual identities. Lewis believes that this metaphor indicates the coded presence of African sensibilities:

In improvised music, the development of the improvisor is regarded as encompassing not only the formation of individual musical personality, but the harmonization of one's musical personality with social environments, both actual and possible. This emphasis on personal narrative is a clear sign of the strong influence of the Afrological on improvised music.

So is Lewis talking about something other than ART? Is group improvisation different from jamming?

Aloha,

Brad

[zero]

I know what you're saying Brad but I'm not going to play this game. Jamming is not art because the purveyors of culture (music press, industry, promoters) say that it isn't. If we want it to be viewed as art then we need to take one big collective leap forward in terms of our musical educations, understandings, sympathies and desires. Period.

Jazz is not jam. Jazz is art. Jam isn't. I mean we could go in circles for ever and it's not that I agree it's that I'm communicating what the dominant culture (read indy rock twats) view is.

[bradm]

OK, if ART = "perceived as or stated to be art by the press (et al)", then I agree with you (but I'd also put in a lot of other music, too).

Aloha,

Brad

[SaggyBalls]

for some strange reason i feel obliged to pipe in.

okay - to these eyes of mine it seems as though much of the talent in canada is either too focused on aesthetics and content, independantly or together, or not focused enough.

Image is one thing, dima, but product is another and our product is becoming watered down. Who's pushing the limits? who's making the same magic happen for the masses?

We don't have a neil young, joni mitchell, bon dylan, the beatles, mamas and the papas, funkadelic, james brown, or johnny cash for our time. We have people that draw on the greats as influences. There are a select few that draw on their lives for guidance but for the most part, musicans are trying to make product rather than trying to sell themselves...which is different than whoring themselves out. hooray for the pussycat dolls.

A band can have chops but lack the self control to make them stand out magically. focus and work drive those nicely together.

A band can have great songs and a few catchy melodic hooks but lack the skill or confidence to keep their momentum rolling and seem like they know what they're doing. play more shows kids.

An artist can have a spot at a busy club opening for a phat DJ and make really danceable music that a crowd might like...but with the wrong image and presence, s/he won't sell many records and get any props from the crowd to support other gigs...too bad that one needs a new shirt or a clean pair of pants shat shows off a nice behind...but why should that matter?

there are a lot of factord that are holding music and musicians back and unfortunately, most of them are petty and seemingly unfair.

I think those petty issues are making the underemployment of canada's musicians and artists a sad reality. Club owners can get away with paying a DJ or producer rather than a whole band, and most of the time can get more people out than a band can. so do we blame the industry or blame the mindless mob?

neither. that solves nothing. All artists can do is keep creating and working to fulfil their lives. If an artist can't get in touch with him/herself then there will be no magic. only hobby. if that means having to work a job and play music in spare time that's what's necessary for a greater good. If an artist doens't mind being transient and poor then that artist is made to tour.

It's really nice to have a place to live and to be able to support your life. A lack of positive support for music in the arts through the press, government grants, and tax initiatives are driving some of the world's greatest resources to making music solely in their basements, or in rehearsal spaces. We live in the land of the coverband. Too many hearts have been broken I'm afraid.

People like to hear songs they know. people like to dance to a beat that doesn't confuse their feet. they like to anthemically chant words they know and hold dear to themselves. They like the old guitar sounds and riffs.

it's too bad that artists sometimes have to pander to a crowd but sometimes they really like playing the same old tune to rile a crowd up...how many people here like to hear a sweet sweet sugaree, or a rockin wilson. I remember going to see umphrey's in whistler this winter and they closed it out with a fugazi tune - waiting room. they played it as good as the original. now this isn't the same old cover played thousands of times before, but for a fan that doens't matter. it was amazing. fugazi was a magical group. they had something special - passion and magic. People are craving magic and they don't get a chance to experience it as much as they could have 30 years ago...well, pound for pound anyhow. there's skill and there's talent. there's cleverness and then there's intuitiveness. there's the real thing but there's a reasonable facsimile

It's not so much the fate of canjam, it's the fate of music in Canada and around the world. I'm pleased to see a growing community of support for all musicians. It's there on one level, but it's going to take a lot of fighting to overcome the logical excuses that the bigger industry is dishing out. Keep listening for great new art. Keep listening for talent. Keep your ears peeled for passion. If it's real and genuine, bring out your pwn essences and the artists you support might feel it the next time they come through town

there IS money out there to spare. Big business just doesn't want to let potential profits shrink without guaranteed results, and nowadays unless it's a product it's a risk.

The media is a powerful tool, but day by day, more people are spending more time inside - online...watching television...not going out so much. not listening to music with friends so much...

Music helped stop war and calmed conflict. Now it's just distracting us from it and we're paying for it.

[SaggyBalls]

oh shit brad...you create and get a lot from it but you're biased - because you create by jamming.

do you have an idea about the whole arrangement and all the textures when you start jamming, and are able to control your band at the same time?? if you say yes then i applaud your mindless automoton band for having faith in you. kudos for making magic in ottawa.

i hear what zero's saying, but it's not art because the establishment calls it such, it's art because it has something more important behind it. it has intent.

Maybe i jam differently than most people, but when I play with others, i create my part (bass player for those that are curious) I find my path and support the others down the trail...then it comes time to branch off. sometimes we take seperate paths but generally we meet up again to continue our journey. i help the drummer over a log and the guitarists wade through a stream together, but we're still trying to get through the forest in real time. so we are experiencing a magical adventure that helps us grow and learn how to traverse the land...

but if i was creating art, i'd have the route planned out, and have all the survival gear necessary to do it right...maybe i'd make sure to have a machete to cut through some vines.

we could jam a few times to find the correct path, and maybe one of those times i'd bring a machete, but i'd still be working to find the best way to do it for myself and the rest of the collective.

and true - an artist can just paint and find what comes out of it, but it's all about the thought that kicked it off. a one time experience can be art as well, but not if it's just 'a jam'. 'blues in C' is not artistic. it may be an art of science, but it's still more clever than art deserves.

this should in no way make you feel that what you do is less important. It may serve to define your audience, which is probably a great thing. not everybody is going to like what you do so the people that would turn their noses up at you need not waste your time and theirs searching for some sort of art and not sit back to take it in or cut a rug on the dancefloor.

Edited August 28, 2006 by Guest

[Dr_Evil_Mouse]

This discussion is very silly.

Bantering over what constitutes "art" is an exercise, to use the hackneyed phrase, in futility (and that's not art). My touchstone on the point is Theodor Adorno, who famously (and, imo, rightly) argued that all art since Auschwitz is garbage. Art failed, big time, except to mask how low humanity has sunk, and it's pretty much impossible to imagine it doing better in different circumstances.

When I don't want to go so far, I'd rather play with the distinction between craft and art. Some joker can play the same blistering licks night after night with no insight or genuine passion, and as far as I can see, that's crafty. Neato. You hear it once, and you've heard it twice. It doesn't really matter to me how much "intent" may be behind it - road to hell, and all that. Conversely, as a radically non-plastic art, I do think a jam, however loosely conceived, can emerge from, and form, genuine artistry. Musicians need to listen, and be adaptable, in those circumstances, and to deny that that is art seems kind of pointless.

This remains true, I think, however the money comes in. Yes, it sucks how hard it is to be a musician these days and everything. I'd love to have seen, say, the Rheostatics hit it huge and see massive royalty cheques pour in. But it didn't happen, and just might never. People prefer schlock and flash. That's why our culture is so incorrigibly lame.

It's a bit tangential, but I'm reminded of the little aside from Joni Mitchell (on Miles of Aisles), where she comments on the difference between music and the plastic arts; nobody, she observes, ever yelled out to Van Gogh, "Hey man, paint 'Starry Night' again!"

That said, back to the night's episodes of Trailer Park Boys. Now that's art.

[SaggyBalls]

Conversely, as a radically non-plastic art, I do think a jam, however loosely conceived, can emerge from, and form, genuine artistry.

and that is the big deal in the 'jamband' universe. are they just counting or is it something more?

Is it about artistic ability or the final product?

either way, I hope the groovy players don't ever give up. I just find a lot of music everywhere to be tedious. I'll come out of my pessimistic haze someday i'm sure.

[c-towns]

So where are we now?

[c-towns]

I re-read this whole thread, its good for some laughs.

Musically, The Fat Cats seem to be the only band from this thread playing with any sort of regularity, all be it, 6 times or so a year.
 

[c-towns]

I guess a better question is, what is everyone from the bands named in this thread doing musically now? (feel free to add what you know)

 

The Fat Cats - Still playing 6 or so gigs a year, side projects include Stumbleweed, Acousticats, (insert more info here)
Burt Neilson Band - One off BnB gigs, side projects include Peter Elkas Band, Littlefoot Longfoot, The Trews (insert more info here)
nero - One off nero gigs, side projects include Pleasurecraft, Death Cake, (insert more info here)
Diesel Dog - Still play regular gigs, side projects include Stumbleweed,  (insert more info here)
Jimmy Swift Band - Disbanded, side projects include, Scientists of Sound, (insert more info here) 
Grand Theft Bus - Still play occasional shows, side projects include, The Olympic Symphonium, (insert more info here)

Slowcoaster - Still play somewhat regular shows, side projects include (insert more info here)
Days of You - One off shows, side projects include, The Mark T Band (insert more info here)
Caution Jam - Still play occasional shows in Toronto, side projects include Mark Crissinger Solo, (insert more info here)
What the Thunder Said - Disbanded, Deeps is in a number of projects in Hamilton, side projects include (insert more info here)
Vanderpark - Disbanded, side projects include (insert more info here)
High Plains Drifter - Disbanded, side projects include House of David Gang, Jaydawg's Hype Machine (insert more info here)
Slammin Jack - Disbanded, side projects include (insert more info here)

Themasses - Disbanded, side projects include Cloud City, mother mother, BEFE  (insert more info here)
Recipe from a Small Planet - Disbanded, side projects include (insert more info here)
Blue Quarter - Disbanded, side projects include (insert more info here)

Mr.Something Something - Disbanded, side projects include, The DoneFors, Drumhand (insert more info here)
Jomomma -  Disbanded, side projects include The Elmo Combo (insert more info here)
tala - Disbanded, side projects include (insert more info here)

Ferriswheeler - Disbanded, side projects include (insert more info here)

Bluegrassy High - No relevant information necessary

Downtime - Disbanded, side projects include nero,  (insert more info here)

The New Deal - Still play somewhat regular shows, side projects include Dragonette, The Join, One Step Beyond (insert more info here)

Stephen Franke and Noises from the Toolshed - Disbanded, side projects include (insert more info here)



 

[bradm]

Jimmy Swift Band - current Hiatus, side projects include (insert more info here)

I think JSB is beyond hiatus, and into "completely done" territory. The main side project is "Scientists Of Sound"

 

Grand Theft Bus - Still play occasional shows, side projects include (insert more info here)

I've heard GTB is working on another record. "The Olympic Symphonium" is the main side project

 

Mr.Something Something - Disbanded, side projects include (insert more info here)

Post-Mr.SS projects include "The DoneFors" (Paul and Liam) and "Drumhand" (Larry)

 

Aloha,

Brad

[weezy]

Blast from the past thread!!

Re Themasses: yours truly is in Cloud City in Ottawa. We're definitely doing funk-based jamband music. (Come out on Friday to Mercury Lounge)

Ali, drummer in Themasses, joined Mother Mother around 2009 which pretty much ended Themasses.

Eric, bass player, has a Vancouver band called BEFE.

[bradm]

I had a "The world has moved on" moment the other day, when I realized that 2014 was a year during which I didn't go Mavericks, not even once, the first such year since they opened (2004). I only went to Cafe Dekcuf once, and only stayed for about half the bands.

 

Aloha,

Brad

[Jay Funk Dawg]

Blast from the past...  Canadian Jam scene had it's day.. incidentally it's alive and well here in the good ol' USA

 

 

High Plains Drifter - Original band that I formed at St. F.X. university disbanded back in 2006, a few years after I relocated back to Toronto. I revived the material with members of Chameleon Project, Heavyweights Brass Band, Wassabi Collective, Drumhand and many Humber College Students.  Became my solo project, we kept the spirit alive playing mostly in Toronto with random members, simplified arrangements, sort of a free for all...  Band played alongside Moses Mayes, Fort Knox Five, Femi Kuti, Orogone, Tea Leaf Green.  Over time we moved away from the acid jazz fusion sound to afrobeat, ethio-jazz sound & reggae.  House of David Gang backing band became High Plains Drifter (often featuring late keyboardist James Gray formerly of Blue Rodeo) between 2008 and 2012 toured to the East Coast serveral times and always had special guests.  Wasn't exactly a serious project, but had a blast - I was more focused on being a promoter.  Our biggest claim to fame might be having been "shredded" on youtube, someone redubbed the music from our performance at Evolve Fest in 2004.  Fond memories indeed! 

[Davey Boy 2.0]

it all fell apart once Bluegrassy High disbanded, IMO

[Guest Low Roller]

Absolute on-point topic C-Towns! Props.

Do bands like Downtime, Ferriswheeler, and The New Deal merit inclusion into your list?

 

And yes Bluegrassy High, or BGH as they were simply known to their legions of fans, were the far reaching pinnacle of Can Jam, never to be duplicated or surpassed again. It just didn't get any better than that band in my books as they expertly navigated through intricate jam-laden songs.

Unfortunately a deep-rooted seething hatred developed amongst band members for stealing each others' noodling solo time during mighty heady jams. It ruined what could have been the next golden-age in music.Their last hit, Eight Bars Isn't Enough, was a clever double-entendre that highlighted the competitive troubles of the musicians in the band as well as their rampant alcoholism.