Caution Jam ,Diesel Dog live at Mavericks Saturday May 5th

[mark tonin]

Once again, I'm reminded of the fact that message boards have significant limitations as a communication tool, and as a result, things can spin out in a negative way. Hopefully things can be resolved positively between the parties involved.

Diesel Dog is out on the road supporting a new cd (which I think is great, listening to it right now actually)

I think that it's an excellent disc, and it's nice to read that you are enjoying it Pablo. It's well-produced, and it contains a bunch of catchy songs that are relatively short and stripped of long jams, which is somewhat ironic given what has been said in this thread, and even more ironic given that Diesel Doug played a huge part in the recording, engineering, and production of the disc.

Peace, Mark

[\/\/illy]

Once again, I'm reminded of the fact that message boards have significant limitations as a communication tool, and as a result, things can spin out in a negative way. Hopefully things can be resolved positively between the parties involved.

As I've said before, this place makes as many enemies as it does friends.

[slavetothegroove]

Yeah we picked up the Year of the Dog cd as well and it's very impressive. We could definitely tell it was well produced and the songs all flowed together like one long jam....kept you riding along. Listened to the whole thing then had to put it on again right away cause it was just too good.

Good job guys. Is the CD available around town anywhere or just for order?

Cheers

Steph

[Freak By Night]

I've seen your band before' date=' and I was impressed. But what you said here leaves me with no desire to support you in the future. [/quote']

Dude, I really don't want to make enemies here, but if that's all it takes than you should stop listening to music all together because you don't get it. Imagine if you were to get to hear Jerry post on a message board a week after every dissapointing show he had? Would you hate the Dead less?

I stopped listening to music in 1978. Everyone knows that's when rock and roll was perfected.

[NewRider]

I haven't heard the album but the shows I've heard are in-fucking-credible! Took a long time to get that album out but I'll bet it's worth the wait.

Keep on truckin'

[rubberdinghy]

but I also still want my money back from Shoreline.

You guys can keep my money...

[gentlemonkey]

When I referred to "people"I was using tact and not specifying you....AD. It's you who needs to take me out of context to try to get your feeble negative point across. I believe I originally stated feelings I have for improv. and music in general,to expand upon Pablo and Velvets sentiments about the "scene". The fact that you need to jump on someone's statement of feelings says it all. You must have nothing to be proud of. You are the antithesis of most everyone on this board and now we all know it. How about you expose some of your deepest feelings so we can all verbally kick you in the teeth. What's the matter, didn't your parents love you enough? Keep your negativity to yourself unless it actually is constructive. Oh, by the way that shot in the foot....it doesn't hurt AT ALL!

dude, I loved the band, but I think its a bad idea for you to be writing stuff like this about anyone online. Consider an outside perspective- you are representing your band with these words? it just looks bad. People are allowed to have opinions.. And AD is a very passionate music fan, and anyone who reads this site knows that. IMprov is a beautiful thing, but I think a masterpeice of composition speaks much stronger.

YES- the show rocked.

NO- it was not well attended.

YES- Ottawa's 'jam' scene has gone downhill a bit

NO- the bands dont/havent come regularly enough to build something.. not easy to do here.

YES- Mavericks promotes- but why not put up some posters with stealies for a show like this to get new fans out, get street team together to handbill? Advertising and working a show is not only the venue's responsibility.

NO- I didnt want to go, becuase it was nice out.

YES- I went, was glad I was there, enjoyed the tunes and wished there were more there to enjoy.

I dont think this was the final nail in any coffins, but I think it proves this site is not as young as it once was- bands/venues need to actively expand their audiences.. its as much (if not more) their responsibility, as it is that of the 'community'.

Blunt point: Relying on a bunch of dogfuckers pretending to work, is not going to fill a bar.

[Velvet]

ieseldoug]

Blunt point: Relying on a bunch of dogfuckers pretending to work, is not going to fill a bar.

So beautiful.

Edited May 9, 2007 by Guest

[AD]

and for what it's worth, i didn't say anything all that 'negative' or inflammatory at all in this thread. certainly nothing as poetic as 'lick my balls' to a group of music fans.

but that's neither here nor there. i swore i was done with this. this friends / enemies talk - i've never met this guy, i wouldn't call him an enemy by any stretch. it's all out of proportion. gotta be dialed back.

the monkey makes good points about most things up above.

[MarcO]

At this time, I'd like to mount a defence of "musical snobbery", as it was one of the first arrows out of Diesel Doug's sling and has been brought up in other contexts.

I don't mean snobbery in the sense that hamilton claimed, where one APPROACH to music is considered to be the ideal to the held above others. He was right about that but that's not what I mean.

What I mean is pride in personal aesthetic. the pursuit of quality music..... It's a process that compounds upon itself: the more you listen, the more you learn.... you keep searching, you pass on what doesn't move you and embrace that which does, the less questions asked the better. The idea that something *has* to contain improvisation to be of worth does a couple of negative things: it precludes a whole range of music from being of worth to you and it has the potential to lower the bar for what you consider to be GOOD vs BAD improv.

It's a criticism I've long held in regards to this scene: suddenly taking a stage and "jamming" becomes the end game, judgments be damned. It's seen as an altruistic endeavour ("the bands, they give us so much") when in the end it's an artistic endeavour ("the bands give themselves so much and I may bear witness to this"). There's a big difference and I fall on the latter side, not the former.

And so the danger is that then Grateful Dead = Phish = Disco Biscuits = nero = BNB = Diesel Dog = whoever. That's not musical appreciation, it's appreciation of the lifestyle that is SEEN to be connected with "improvisational" music. Which is ok, I guess, but it also tends to alienate those of us who do enjoy these bands and improvisational music but have cultivated a real distaste for some aspects of the supposedly attending lifestyle.

So, no wonder people who actually do take music seriously (which ironically doesn't always seem to be the musicians themselves in some cases) get their backs up when they get called out for being "negative". I can't think of anything more negative than just dishing out "positive vibes" at the expense of the art that is supposed to bring people - of all stripes - together. It doesn't do ANYONE any good. So, in that sense I'm happy to be a musical snob. I don't know why I like what I like, but I like A LOT of stuff and dislike a fair amount, not in equal measure but applied with equal measure: you don't get a free pass because I like you as a person and think it's cool you're jamming out for your friends. And for the record, I have had some fun nights with Diesel Dog and probably will again, they're a good time bar band as far as I'm concerned, and good luck to them. But you gotta be smart. You have to know that improv is not an end in itself and there are others approaches to music that are as equally valid, and potentially more rewarding.

There's no territory to defend. There's no obligation to represent. Musics don't cancel each other out. Maybe a good number of people in Ottawa didn't really see the appeal in spending a Saturday night with a band that is by definition anachronistic in focusing on Dead covers. They chose other options because they recognize have them. It's really not a mystery. I mean, no wonder nero did well - they sounded different, fresh, new, exciting, unpredictable.

As for the whole friends/enemies thing, it's kind of silly to let a musical disagreement spill over into a personal one. Message boards are for debating things, not rubbing each others' shoulders and saying "it's all good brah".

[Booche]

I just popped a boner.

[Hux]

Skipped MarcO's blog (yawn) but I wonder how many people who didn't go to the show on Sat. had NOT heard DD's new CD?

I'll start:

1. (me)

[Davey Boy 2.0]

...the point being?

[Super Freak]

[quote name=hamilton

"Music lovers" wouldn't attempt to invalidate every form of musical expression other then the one they prefer by saying that all other forms are contrived and lacking in truth. Actually' date=' that sounds like something a music snob would do.

Really? THAT'S what you got out of Doug's comment? Wow, that's almost as well rounded as whoever(don't care) said that he insulted EVERYONE on the board or the person(still don't care) who claims Doug shot himself in the foot and now would never go to see the band.

All I saw was a guy trying to calm some folks who were upset about community support, saying that shit happens, they had a great time anyway. He added some musical opinions and got called out harshly.

This thread was angry before Doug said a word.

Paisley's comment was bang on.

I personally love Ottawa. Lived there for a school year. It's a university town--it's hit and miss for the bar scene, they're all like that(U towns), are they not? Sorry, I just thought I'd comment on that part of the thread where it seemed to get ugly. I've chummed with bands for 15 years now and every band gets nights where the turnout is less than ideal. It's part of the game.

I've got to run, I need to turn my stereo up to 11, 10's not cutting it.

[bagochips]

More righteousness would benefit this conversation (and this "scene") more than more self-righteousness.

[Davey Boy 2.0]

Quagmire (running through mall and accidentally into the camera room): Where am I, am I dead?

Security Guard: No, this is where we monitor all the dressing rooms in the mall so we can keep an eye out for shoplifters.

(Woman on Monitor has heart attack)

Quagmire: Oh my God! That one's having a heart attack! (Runs to womans dressing room.)

Quagmire: (Rubs womans chest and breathes in her mouth. Woman becomes conscious.)

Woman#2: That was amazing!

Woman#3: You saved her life!

Woman#4: Thank God you know CPR!

Quagmire: What the hell is CPR?

Edited May 9, 2007 by Guest
righteousness

[Pablo Sanchez]

You know what I've noticed here. It seems like some people are just itching to jump all over someone.

Its too bad because the vide around here is definitely more of a go the fuck away thing than anything else.

[PalacePrincess]

WTF is this mess?

1. Diesel Dog is awesome.

2. The members of Diesel Dog are awesome. ESPECIALLY Doug.

3. If you haven't seen Diesel Dog in the last while, you are really missing out. They have totally stepped up their game over the years. Every time this band plays, they get better and better.

4. Every single time I've seen Diesel Dog (which has been more times than I can possibly count), I have pure, unadulterated FUN with all capital letters and maybe even some swear words thrown in. They make me dance and mean it, there are ALWAYS fun people I like at the shows, the music is never half-assed or disappointing, and it's a fricken treat-of-the-week if you have the pleasure of hanging out with any of these guys after the show.

Doug steps into an already pages long crankypants party themed with whether ottawa sucks or not, whether the scene is dead, and how many lawn chairs you can cram into mavericks, and out of this entire buffet of miscontent, he's being targeted? this is just very odd.

[Super Freak]

Word, Wonder Woman.

[\/\/illy]

Doug steps into an already pages long crankypants party themed with whether ottawa sucks or not, whether the scene is dead, and how many lawn chairs you can cram into mavericks, and out of this entire buffet of miscontent, he's being targeted? this is just very odd.

Beautifully stated. However, it doesn't seem "very odd" to me, it seems pretty par for the course. Sad though.

[MarcO]

I don't think he was targeted. I think he made a provacative post and there was some fall-out. Big deal.

[Blaze-0]

I'll second that Ottawa Sucks Balls.

[Super Freak]

Provacative?

He stated his opinions on improv music and his love for that form of art.

This is becoming quite entertaining.

[MarcO]

Stating an opinion on improvised music is one thing. Saying

People always come back to improv. because it's the only sincere form of music. All other music is somewhat contrived or pre-meditated resulting in a lack of truth

is provocative and begs a response. See?

[GUITARZAN]

Wow, you would have figured that this thread would have ended 4 pages ago...but no still going strong! Impressive

Boredom is a bitch