Hybrid car advice?

[Calamity Jane]

Well, about a year before we were ready for/planning for it, we may be in the market for a new car (unless a mechanic can perform one more life saving maneuver on our hot pink beastie-car.

Has anyone on here purchased the Honda Civic Hybrid? Any stories, advice, caution?

We really need a van/SUV type thing for the fam, but I think the Civic is the only thing in our price range. Again, any guidance youse skanks can offer is always appreciated.

[AD]

the civic is not a van or an SUV... soooo i'm confused.

[Jaimoe]

I went to a lecture last night at the U of T by Jane Goodall. She 'delightfully' mentioned that biofueled cars and SUV's are bad for the environment, even though they are marketed as green. It's pretty obvious when you think about what the fuel is and where it comes from. Anyway, I'm not sure if biofueled cars and vans fall under the hybrid title, but good it's something to consider if they do.

[Ms.Huxtable]

I read somewhere that the ecological footprint of producing a hybrid engine/battery is far worse than that of conventional vehicles.

If you want a hybrid, do it for better gas consumption, not the sake of the environment.

Then again if you're buying to save money at the pump, thre are a ton of other options out there for fuel efficient vehicles.

Sorry to here about your beastie's pink parts.

[Basher]

I have a Civic Hybrid. I love it but obviously you do not get the mileage they advertise. I average just over 700km for a 35L fill-up. The Prius gets better mileage, and the fact that the rear seat folds down and it is a hatchback gives you much more space. Email me if you have any more questions, and check http://greenhybrid.com for lots of articles.

[boiler]

Going diesel may be the best option.

[Tooly]

Well, about a year before we were ready for/planning for it, we may be in the market for a new car (unless a mechanic can perform one more life saving maneuver on our hot pink beastie-car.

Has anyone on here purchased the Honda Civic Hybrid? Any stories, advice, caution?

We really need a van/SUV type thing for the fam, but I think the Civic is the only thing in our price range. Again, any guidance youse skanks can offer is always appreciated.

how about converting your car to run on water?

Hers How To Do It

maybe your mechanic could do that for you, its easy enough, my uncle in law has converted his big old suburban to run on water. save alot of money at the pumps, thats for sure. and you can recycle the water, so you arent really using that much water at all, a few litres a week if you set up a good re-capturing system.

Frequently Asked Questions

Q: Does it really work ?

A: Yes; this is well-established technology dating back to stainless steel. But be sure to follow these instructions using the proper mechanical and electrical assembly techniques, as this plan incorporates the best qualities of several techniques.

Q: How does it qualify as "free energy"?

A: If you're paying someone for the water you use, then it is not strictly free. But the alternative is to keep buying into expen$ive ga$oline and its resultant hydrocarbon pollution.

Q: Is it safe?

A: Technically, it is safer than running on fossil fuel because you are no longer choking on your own emissions (health-wise). In general, it is practically as safe as your current gasoline arrangement. You will be installing a few simple safety devices, using current automotive standards.

Q: What kind of performance can I expect?

A: Properly adjusted, your modified vapor-only fuel system will run cooler, and at a modestly higher power level. The mileage performance expected from this design ranges from 50-300 mpg (of water), depending on your adjusting skills.

Q: Can I do the modification myself?

A: Why not? If you don't have any mechanical skills, and you know someone with basic mechanical and/or electrical skills, you can even delegate some of the construction. If you are using a fuel-injected engine, you may have to get a mechanic's opinion. [There will have to be an adapter inserted into the fuel-injection system, just as you would have to do if you were going to run on propane, hydrogen, or natural gas. Ed.)

Q: What is the environmental impact that my vehicle will have?

A: It will be producing H20 steam (water vapor) and unburnt O2 (Oxygen). Hence, it will be cleaning the environment, rather than dumping nauseous toxins into it. Plus you will be helping to save our dwindling supply of atmospheric oxygen. Any excess vapor in the reaction becomes either steam or oxygen. You can also expect to be receiving more than casual interest from those around you.

Q: Isn’t this really a steam engine?

A: No. Really. Exceedingly high temperature and pressure are not used. This is strictly an internal-combustion engine (burning orthohydrogen) with residual steam in the exhaust as a by-product.

these points from this page here

Edited September 16, 2007 by Guest

[M.O.B.E]

the civic is not a van or an SUV... soooo i'm confused.

We really need a van/SUV type thing for the fam, [color:red]but I think the Civic is the only thing in our price range.

Whats to be confused about??

Good luck CJ. I wanted to get a diesel VW van when we were shopping for our new van. The price is a little more but the fuel cost makes up for the price.

[Gateaux]

We bought a 2007 Yaris sedan this year. It's not a Hybrid but it's amazing on gas and there's plenty of trunk space/rear folding seats. It's actually a surprisingly roomy car.

[Kanada Kev]

Anyone have any experience with older Mercedes diesels? I'm interested in some 82-85 model years. Curious about maintenance, parts availability, reliability, etc. I need a second vehicle (the 87 BMW is near death).

[bokonon]

if you get a hybrid make sure you know where to get it serviced, not all garages can do them (obviously)

If you want a nice fuel efficient car check out the new Taurus. V6, 40 MPG and 263 horsepower and it's nice. Big trunk too so you can fit tons of instruments in it too!

[StoneMtn]

I love my Smart, CJ, but you already drove it, so you know what it's like. (You can't take kids in it, either, because it can't take a car-seat.)

[Kanada Kev]

I love my Smart, CJ, but you already drove it, so you know what it's like. (You can't take kids in it, either, because it can't take a car-seat.)

LOL ... that's kinda bizarre. How SMART is it it then?? . I guess your car only takes people that are smart enough to NOT need a car seat (or are simply BIG kids ).

I've always wondered what those cars are like on the highway ...

[StoneMtn]

They are amazing on the highway. I took it to Muskoka and back just today.

We have a second car for the child, because you cannot legally put a car-seat in a two-seater. She isn't always with us, for instance every day when I go to work and back, and it is "smart" to use less car most of the time if that is all you need; which is the case with us (and I think most people).

[dancingbear]

nothing is perfect ie. diesel, hybrid etc. but a hybrid is better for with respect to contributing less to global warming than a regular gas car. i agree however there are issues with the batteries.

the ford escape hybrid seems about the same price as the civic hyprd. it gets an advertised 35mpg and might solve your SUV dilemma.

[phishtaper]

Going diesel may be the best option.

i have a naive question. what exactly is better about diesel? it certainly can't be the emissions because they are horrendous (honestly, I dont know how any diesel car would pass a regular emissions test). so, is it just that you generally get better mileage, and therefore use less gas? or, is it something in the way it is refined? inquiring minds want to know ...

[bokonon]

Diesel gets you about 25% better mileage compared to gas. And I know that VW TDI's actually are not too bad on emissions if they are maintained properly. Maintenance and lubrication are the key!!

[AdamH]

Everything is relative to everything else:

Resource inputs to produce the car / emissions produced by the car / distance travelled on a tank of gas / type of gas used / energy required to dispose of the car / energy or inputs required to maintain the car

With that mouthful, and you saying you need space, I'd probably go with either a used import minivan or an import wagon like a Diesel Jetta Wagon. You get the space you need, you buy something used so ethically speaking you're not demanding new raw materials to build a car, and if it's diesel you'll get more miles to the gallon which for me would outweigh the still-questionable environmental gains made with a hybrid (which is still too new a technology to be a foolproof argument IMO)

There's a 2004 Jetta Wagon TDI on kijiji right now for under $20K. It reportedly gets 4.9L/100KM which is pretty damned incredible.

[timouse]

Going diesel may be the best option.

i have a naive question. what exactly is better about diesel? it certainly can't be the emissions because they are horrendous (honestly' date=' I dont know how any diesel car would pass a regular emissions test). so, is it just that you generally get better mileage, and therefore use less gas? or, is it something in the way it is refined? inquiring minds want to know ...

[/quote']

less energy input to refine the fuel and better mileage combine to make diesel a slightly less evil choice. the exhaust that comes out of a diesel tailpipe is chemically much cleaner or simpler than gasoline vehicle exhaust. not only that but you can run a diesel engine on a variety of oil products from biodiesel to straight vegetable oil.

the original question was about a hybrid...i have a friend who owns the escape hybrid and seems quite pleased with it no idea how the advertised mileage stacks up to reality though.

Edited September 17, 2007 by Guest

[phishtaper]

so, the diesels that I see everyday that visibly emit smoke are just badly maintained? (diesels shouldnt emit any smoke at all?) ... because I see dozens of spewy diesel vehicles everyday, including almost all older vw's, benz's, as well as school busses, transpo vans, etc.

school busses that idle at the side of the road for 30 minutes to 'warm up' are one of my pet peeves.

[Kanada Kev]

Why is that? Why do trucks, busses, etc. always leave their engines idling? Is it hard to start 'em up again or something?

[Davey Boy 2.0]

yes apparently "they" say that 'cold starts' are hard on the engine, fwiw

[AcidNintendoOrgan]

Prius! Prius! Prius!

They have tonnes of room. Our little family has a 4 door hatch back and I cannot say enough about it. They are also cheaper than the Civic. There is a bit of a curve to "learning" to drive it though. What I mean by this is that as you are driving, one of the computer screen features (which can be very distracting at first) is that you can watch your consumption of fuel in almost real time. Use the cruise! It'll be your best friend......except on hills. With any vehicle you are going to use more power->fuel going up an incline. But if you are controlling the throttle as opposed to the car, you might get there a bit slower but it'll save gas. I'm never in that much of a hurry anyway. If you get a nice stretch of flat highway it is not that hard to get between 4.2L and 4.8L of consumption per 100km. Also, as far as getting it serviced, next to Subaru, I couldn't find a better extended warranty. Nor have I had to use it thus far with over 45,000km. Give this car a second look!

[Freak By Night]

Regarding the discussion about diesel vs. biodiesel, this is from davidsuzuki.org

Biofuels not necessarily all that green

Earlier this year, when I crossed our great country to talk to Canadians about environmental issues, some media pundits took issue with our vehicle of choice - a diesel bus. Even when I explained that diesel actually has a lower carbon footprint than gasoline, some of them immediately shot back with - then why isn't it biodiesel?

In truth, we had actually wanted to showcase an alternative fuel like biodiesel, we just couldn't find a leasing agent who could get us an appropriate vehicle. But from the very beginning we were also nervous about highlighting something that might be more of a problem than a solution.

Turns out, we were probably right. According to a recent analysis published in the journal Science, attempting to save the planet by wholesale switching to biofuels like ethanol and biodiesel may unintentionally have the opposite effect.

Proponents of biofuels, which are often made from plants such as corn or sugar cane, often point to their many advantages over fossil fuels like gasoline. Biofuels are less toxic or non-toxic in comparison to fossil fuels. They are a renewable resource, whereas once fossil fuels are gone, they're gone. And biofuels can be grown just about anywhere you can grow crops, reducing the need for giant pipelines or oil tankers, and potentially helping to reduce conflicts in areas like the Middle East.

So far so good. But things start to get complicated when you look more closely. Much has already been debated about the energy requirements to produce some biofuels, especially corn-based ethanol. Ethanol made from corn only contains marginally more energy than what is needed to produce it. In fact, we use about a litre's worth of fossil fuels to grow, harvest, process, and transport a litre of corn-based ethanol. Many people argue that making corn-based ethanol is more of an agricultural subsidy for farmers than it is a sound environmental policy.

Things get even dodgier for biofuels when you look at the land area that would be needed to grow fuel crops. We use a lot of fossil fuels. Switching to biofuels would not reduce the demand for fuel, just change the way we get it. And that would require a lot of land. In fact, substituting just 10 per cent of fossil fuels to biofuels for all our vehicles would require about 40 per cent of the entire cropland in Europe and North America. That is simply not sustainable.

Of course, reducing the amount of fuel we use, no matter what the type, is very important. But the authors of the recent article in Science say that if our primary motive in switching to biofuels is to reduce global warming, then we have to look at all our options for the land that would be needed to grow fuel crops.

The authors conclude: "If the prime object of policy on biofuels is mitigation of carbon dioxide-driven global warming, policy-makers may be better advised in the short term (30 years or so) to focus on increasing the efficiency of fossil fuel use, to conserve the existing forests and savannahs, and to restore natural forest and grassland habitats on cropland that is not needed for food."

In other words, biofuels alone are not the quick-fix answer to global warming. In fact, strong legislated policies to improve the efficiency of our cars, homes and industries is a much more effective strategy. In the longer term, biofuels may certainly play an important role. Some technologies, like cellulosic ethanol, which is made from woody debris, are very promising and they need to be supported by government and industry now, so they can be available on a larger scale in the coming years. Biofuels have many advantages, but we have to look at all our options and make sure we make the best choices to ensure a more sustainable future.

Take the Nature Challenge and learn more at davidsuzuki.org

[Paan]

Interesting article here comparing the Prius to the Hummer... turns out this viewpoint believes the Prius to be worse for the environment...

http://clubs.ccsu.edu/recorder/editorial/print_item.asp?NewsID=188

I still believe that aside from not owning a car, a small diesel car is the best choice right now.